Animals and vaccinations.

[miss_thenorth]

Hijack of my own thread----Bee, I emailed the company you suggested on BYH about sea kelp or whatever it was for a mineral supplement--you said you got some from them. they haven't gotten back to me.

Back to the issue at hand. I do plan on calling my vet, but want to get as much from you guys first. (and my internet research) That way I'll be a bit more educated, and not just be spoonfed by what the vet might tell me, although she is wonderful.

 

[Beekissed]

Hijack of my own thread----Bee, I emailed the company you suggested on BYH about sea kelp or whatever it was for a mineral supplement--you said you got some from them. they haven't gotten back to me.

I didn't hear from them when I emailed either but I did ask my local feed store to order me some...they had never even heard of using kelp as a mineral supplement. They ordered it in for me and it was a little cheaper this way as I didn't have to pay the shipping.

Doesn't hurt to ask! Maybe this site is only interested in selling wholesale to distributors? I mainly referred to the site as a source of info on the efficacy of the kelp as a mineral supplement.

 

[Blackbird]

I agree with Bee. There is absolutely no warranty of health on any thing or any body, even if there is hype that the vaccinations are.

We do not vaccinate any of our animals, not the goats, not the donkey when we still had him, not the dogs, nothing. I don't believe in vaccinations. Even when I bought Heathcliff I bought him knowing that I would not continue vaccinations, that whether or not he did get them, he could possibly die from anything, and having faith that he wouldn't.

Further more, just as humans can have bad reactions to vaccines, so can animals. I have a friend who lost several of her goats to I believe it was CD&T and berculosis vaccinations.

Dairy cattle are especially pushed to get the vaccinations because they are often in confined quarters eating whatever is pushed in front of them with milking equipment that is shared by multiple other animals. That kind of setup definitely hosts many more deadly pathogens than yours would. Many large dairies cannot afford NOT to vaccinate because of the conditions.

 

[miss_thenorth]

I agree with Bee. There is absolutely no warranty of health on any thing or any body, even if there is hype that the vaccinations are.

We do not vaccinate any of our animals, not the goats, not the donkey when we still had him, not the dogs, nothing. I don't believe in vaccinations. Even when I bought Heathcliff I bought him knowing that I would not continue vaccinations, that whether or not he did get them, he could possibly die from anything, and having faith that he wouldn't.

Further more, just as humans can have bad reactions to vaccines, so can animals. I have a friend who lost several of her goats to I believe it was CD&T and berculosis vaccinations.

Dairy cattle are especially pushed to get the vaccinations because they are often in confined quarters eating whatever is pushed in front of them with milking equipment that is shared by multiple other animals. That kind of setup definitely hosts many more deadly pathogens than yours would. Many large dairies cannot afford NOT to vaccinate because of the conditions.

Thanks BB. And I agree. My thinking is, my cow will be the only cow here, she will not be confined or raised in filthy conditions. The guy I got her from is getting a dexter bull, and we have agreed to have Annabelle bred to his bull when the time comes. He has a small herd, and takes very good care of his animals. So I am not concerned about her picking up anything while being bred. I did alot of research last night at the university of google (thanks for the term, whoever posted it) and have decided not to vaccinate. We will, however, be ordering my microscope this week. I'm going with the one recommended on the Fias Co website--you can't beat $73.

Now I am having second thoughts about vaccinating my horses. I wonder if we can still ride with the club if we choose not to vaccinate them.

 

[aggieterpkatie]

I have mixed thoughts on vaccines. I do believe they are overused in some cases. I also believe that they are very important in some cases.

Look how many diseases have been controlled by vaccines! I mean, before vaccines were created many people died of things that are easily preventable now.

I definitely vaccinate my dogs against rabies, and I do their puppy shots when they are pups. Why risk something like rabies or parvo when they are easily preventable? And cheap! I can get a rabies vaccine at a clinic for $5, and I can get my own 5 or 7 way puppy shot for $5.50. If you ask me, that's a cheap price to pay for safety and peace of mind. Yeah, I'm sure there are cases of animals getting sick (like with parvo for example) but the cases of puppies getting parvo when not vaccinated WAY outnumber those who get sick after vaccinated.

I vaccinate my sheep and goats with CD/T. Again, a very inexpensive way to make sure those diseases are prevented. I also give the tetanus anti-toxin when I dock or castrate, because it's a cheap way for me to make sure I do all I can to keep them healthy. To me, it's no different than dipping navels in iodine when they're born. It's cheap, so why not do it? Yeah, they might live without dipping their navels, but there's a good chance they could get sick if not. I've seen babies die of navel ill, and it's such a waste when it could have been easily prevented.

That said, I don't get vaccines like Lyme or Bordatella or things like that with my dogs, because I dont' believe the benefits outweight the "risk" without it. I also stop doing distemper when the dog is a few years old.

 

[patandchickens]

If it were me, I think I would ask my vet or Guelph (whichever you'd trust more) how common brucellosis (Bang's) is in southwestern Ontario. Don't ask your vaccination question first, don't use the 'v' word at all -- just ask how common it is.

That should get you a reasonably informative answer from which you can make your own decision what to do.

Personally for something like brucellosis that is transmissible to humans and can be resident-but-not-symptomatic in an animal at the time of purchase, I would want to know what the odds are of the disease being present before deciding not to vaccinate and then drink raw milk. Unless ON (or wherever the cows come from) is pretty darn near brucellosis-free most of the time, personally I'd vaccinate if I were going to drink raw milk. But, everyone has their own ways of looking at things.

Good luck, have fun,

Pat

 

[~gd]

Shoot, I know nothing about cows and vaccs....but a thought, you decide if it applies or not....will she have contact with other cows, or are there any nearby? Will people be going on and off your property who have cows, bringing germs on their boots? How is this disease spread? Will you breed her via AI or live cover?

Etc....That is how my thought process goes for vaccinations. My house cats have none. My dogs get rabies because that is required by law. I have them titered for other stuff but it all went to pot when I had to have emergency surgery on one pooch, and they wouldn't listen to what I wanted, they gave him every vaccination known to canines.

I left that practice for good.

Well that office probably had been exposed to every disease known to canines No telling what it might have picked up there. Unvaccinated may work at home but with a mess like that I would have asked for vaccinations. Your animals, your choice

 

[freemotion]

Some of the vaccinations (most, if not all!) won't work at or after exposure. Exposure for the more serious things needs to be actual animal contact. So I wasn't worried. I keep my animals away from others in the waiting room or mostly I wait in the car. My pets are portable-sized, too!

Oh, and I titer, so they are not unvaccinated. Just not according to the charts and graphs that most vets use.

 

[~gd]

Full disclosure, I worked for more than 20 years making vaccines for human babies. No they don't always work, if the annimal or baby has a poor immune systen some can cause disease. BUT when if ever have you seen a case of Small Pox? Polio? These diseases were wiped out by vaccines. It should be your choice but how would you feel if a bad disease were to happen would you just say it was God's will or would you feel quilty because you could have done something that might have drastically reduced the risk. Your Choice!

 

[miss_thenorth]

I have mixed thoughts on vaccines. I do believe they are overused in some cases. I also believe that they are very important in some cases.

Look how many diseases have been controlled by vaccines! I mean, before vaccines were created many people died of things that are easily preventable now.

I definitely vaccinate my dogs against rabies, and I do their puppy shots when they are pups. Why risk something like rabies or parvo when they are easily preventable? And cheap! I can get a rabies vaccine at a clinic for $5, and I can get my own 5 or 7 way puppy shot for $5.50. If you ask me, that's a cheap price to pay for safety and peace of mind. Yeah, I'm sure there are cases of animals getting sick (like with parvo for example) but the cases of puppies getting parvo when not vaccinated WAY outnumber those who get sick after vaccinated.

I vaccinate my sheep and goats with CD/T. Again, a very inexpensive way to make sure those diseases are prevented. I also give the tetanus anti-toxin when I dock or castrate, because it's a cheap way for me to make sure I do all I can to keep them healthy. To me, it's no different than dipping navels in iodine when they're born. It's cheap, so why not do it? Yeah, they might live without dipping their navels, but there's a good chance they could get sick if not. I've seen babies die of navel ill, and it's such a waste when it could have been easily prevented.

That said, I don't get vaccines like Lyme or Bordatella or things like that with my dogs, because I dont' believe the benefits outweight the "risk" without it. I also stop doing distemper when the dog is a few years old.

See ? I'm not absolutely convinced that vaccinations did indeed prevent those diseases. There were outbreaks that peaked, and then they were in the decline by the time the vaccines came out. So, the vaccines got all the credit for the decline.

There are common vacs given today for humans and animals, and the ppl who were vaccinated still got the disease or illness. Eg--whooping cough, measles, mumps, chicken pox, the flu etc etc. And I speak from experience. I was vaccinated against all of those, (except chicken pox,) and I got every last one. But as far as animals are concerned, there is less information.

Pat, you have a good point, and yes, -- the fact that ppl can get ill from drinking the milk does have me concerned. Thanks for the insightful reply. Which is exactly why I come here with these issues. I will do as you suggest and ask my vet.

Free, the only contact she will have with other cows will be when she is bred, and her own calf. That's it.