Herbal deworming...calling BB or other herbally knowledgable people!

[freemotion]

I got some herbs for deworming the goats and pigs and got a good deal from the co-op on cut, not powdered, wormwood. I found that it doesn't make nice herbal balls for the stubborn goats, so I ran it through my food processor and sifted it. Now I have a couple of jars of powder and a big bag of what looks like mostly chopped stems. I mixed it with a bit of hyssop that got the same treatment.

I brought the bag out to the barn tonight to see how the goats would respond. They all plowed into it! Even the babies, that wouldn't readily take the herbal balls in the past. Of course, they showed a lot more interest when they saw the bigger does shoving each other to get a handful of herbs. Everyone got maybe 2-3 tablespoons or so.

Any opinions on how stems compare in strength and effectiveness to powdered leaf? It smells quite strong. I'm guessing that larger amounts are needed, hence the generous handful each.

Can I use this to deworm in place of the powder? This sure was an easy way to do it! Whatcha think?

 

[Blackbird]

It should be safe to assume that unless specified as leaf that the pre-powdered stuff a person could buy, would actually have stem in it as well. A lot of people, myself included, use a pestle and mortar, so the stems would be broken down into powder too.

I would assume that the stems like the roots are more potent and would contain quite more of the volatile oils but that it would be harder/take longer for the healing properties to 'unleash' or break down to accessibility if we were talking about, say, a tea. I doubt a ruminate would have any issues though.

As long as they enjoy all of the herbs you are giving them, I don't see why you couldn't just feed straight stalks and plant matter like that.

(Psst, thanks for considering me herbally knowledgeable )

 

[Blackbird]

Ok, I got to thinking so I had to look it up.

Healing Wise by Susun Weed says;

"Bark" is a misleading word, as the usual part of the tree or shrub actually used for herbal medicines in the inner bark, or cambium layer, which lies between the true bark and the wood. All the nourishment and life force of the tree, passing between roots and leaves, moves through this layer, making it a rich source of valuable resins, sugars, and astringents. The wood and the bark are dead cells and thus contain little that is medicinally useful. Cambium cell walls are tough, requiring long brewing for full extraction of medicinal virtues.



So yes, overall the stems are beneficial, and since ruminants break down and ferment their foods they will be getting those properties.

 

[freemotion]

I knew you'd know the answer! Thanks!!!

 

[FarmerDenise]

I experimented today with wormwood also. I just cut a largish sprig and tossed some into the chicken yard and some into the goat pasture. Some of the chickens pecked at it and Blossom ate it. Flower sniffed it and left it.
I figure if goats and deer in the wild don't succumb to worms, then maybe if my goats don't have a heavy load yet, then giving them assorted "worming" plants might prevent them ever getting a heavy load. We have quite a few plants growing on the property that are usually in herbal remedies and a few others are available to me. I am hoping by constantly changing it around, it will keep those worms off guard.

Of course I really need a microscope, so I can check.... but until I get one. I'll just have to keep a close eye on my girls.

 

[Blackbird]

That is one thing I would love to do Denise, get a microscope and test deer droppings from wild deer around where I live to see what parasites and worms are prevalent, if any. And then determine which plants they are eating.

 

[valmom]

Anyone know about feeding tobacco as a wormer? The old owner of the barn where I grew up (yes, I did grow up in a barn! ) used to feed the horses cigarettes to get rid of worms. This was ages ago before safe commercial wormers- like 45 years ago- and he was ancient at the time, so it was probably a remedy from the 1930's or so. He said the tobacco would paralyze the worms and they could be passed. The horses loved their monthly cigarettes!

 

[Old Sew'n'Sew]

Hi,
I used to give my goats chewing tobacco or snuff every other month and garlic on the alternate months. They love the tobacco. I think God created tobacco for other purposes than what it is currently used by humans.

 

[aggieterpkatie]

Here's a link saying tobacco is toxic to the animal in the doses needed to kill worms. FWIW.

Natural dewormers and other old-time remedies
With increasing levels of anthelmintic resistance and a movement towards more sustainable farming practices, there is a renewed interest in natural dewormers. Many universities are conducting experiments to determine the efficacy of various natural dewormers and other old-time remedies.

Tobacco has historically been used as an anthelmintic for livestock. While nicotine does have some anthelmintic properties, it is extremely toxic in the doses needed to kill worms. Copper sulfate is another historical worm treatment. The problem is that sheep are very sensitive to copper sulfate and can die if they get too much of it.

In more recent years, scientists have been investigating the use of copper oxide wire particles as an anthelmintic for sheep and goats. Due to a lower absortion rate, this form of copper is safer to administer. with less risk of copper toxicity. So far, the research looks promising. The mode by which copper kills abomasal parasites is unknown.

There are a number of herbs which are known to have anthelmintic properties (e.g. wormwood), but they have the same problem as tobacco - what's poisonous to the worms is also poisonous to the animal when given in a sufficient volume to kill the worms. Numerous plants are being tested for their anthelmintic properties (e.g. pumpkin seed, garlic). So far, none have been proven under formal research conditions to be effective anthelmintics.

Diatomaceous earth (DE) is touted as an anthelmintic, but various studies have failed to prove its efficacy as an anthelmintic. DE is composed primarily of silica (the main component of glass). Their is some evidence that it might be abrasive to the integument of worms in the digestive tract.

 

[Beekissed]

But...if the scientist are funded by drug companies to determine the efficacy of something that people can obtain without buying their product, I'm thinking the scientists would pretty much come to the conclusion they are being paid for.

It happens all the time for human medical research, why not animals?

The controlled conditions in which they use these more natural dewormers are just that....feedlot sheep, goats, cattle...and all in a small area, fed something they deem is good nutrition, not allowed to graze or rotate grazing.

All natural dewormers are best combined with a more natural lifestyle for a ruminant. Vigorous culling for parasite resistance is also key to using a more natural approach....only stands to reason that a goat this is repeatedly undermined by parasites and other illnesses won't respond well to much of anything, let alone a more mild dewormer.

Scientific research is only as good as looking at the source of funding....universities are supported by endowment funds from wealthy patrons. Look to who those might be before believing research.