Interesting dairy farm-- definately not a homestead

[big brown horse]

Hey FarmerChick,

I love your avatar by the way!!!

 

[FarmerChick]

Hey FarmerChick,

I love your avatar by the way!!!

Yea, what a hoot that kitty is....it kinda scares me...LOL

found him on a website and he just stared at me and I knew he would be good on this forum....LOL-LOL

 

[Frosting]

while the "ideal farms etc" can be done on a small scale...you are not feeding monster cities with this type of system. It is just not happening.

Any change over to better farm practices are wonderful and I am all for them....but I still applaud the big agri. companies who DO FEED the people now that they are trying to improve and be a viable business.

There was a very interesting statement made on the radio this morning regarding this. It was that while the company farms have more cows they do not help the population as well as many smaller farms all totally the same number of cows. Why? Because cows don't shop! In other words, instead of many farmers shopping for supplies and equipment you would have only one. That means a lot less supplies and equipment sold. Less sold means less made. Less made means less jobs. Less jobs means less employment. I think you can see what the message was.

 

[FarmerChick]

yea I agree with this statement cause the "whole cycle" of economics is included just like with any type of business.

If a store puts in self-checkout lines....do they take a job away from a cashier? And the footprint of that cashier working? you might

And the message of the article, it has happened thru centuries of this country. When a new situation occurs, old ones are effected. There is nothing new in this at all and centuries have adapted thru these changes. So the message in this article is nothing new at all.

example would be like ---When tractors were invented, did less horses sell to pull a plow? Did horse sales plummet cause cars were invented? Did less saddles have to be made? Did leathermen and horse dealers have less jobs? Did a blacksmith go out of business? Did hay sales drop? Were less horse shoes manufactured? Did the local livery stable close its doors? Did the wagon and buggy maker go out of business? and so on and so on for all that were affected?




But I still say big agri. corps are needed. Millions upon millions live in cities that need to eat and small farms just can't supply that amt. Land is not available to have enough small farms to handle our cities. It is just a fact. Can it change? Probably not but maybe? It is all speculation on how the future will become.

While I am 100% for buying local from small farms if you can in your area, there is still a need for big agri. corp in our world. Key being I applaud them for trying, for wanting to change to better systems and being more eco friendly to what they can do in this world. And simple fact is the world runs on money. So a business, regardless of what it does, must stay viable. It has to do what it can to stay alive and provide a service.

just chatting. I like this area of chat. It is interesting to me.

 

[Frosting]

Land is not available to have enough small farms to handle our cities.

Hmmmm, whether you have 1500 (or whatever amount) cows on a farm or if you have them on several farms, the same amount of land is needed to produce the food for them.

example would be like ---When tractors were invented, did less horses sell to pull a plow? Did horse sales plummet cause cars were invented? Did less saddles have to be made? Did leathermen and horse dealers have less jobs? Did a blacksmith go out of business? Did hay sales drop? Were less horse shoes manufactured? Did the local livery stable close its doors? Did the wagon and buggy maker go out of business? and so on and so on for all that were affected?

I think the difference here is, the hores salesman, leathermen, etc. could retrain for a job that goes with what came with the new, in this example the car. That's not the same as what would happen if small farmers were replaced with cooperate farms. It's not a shift in the type of jobs available but, the availability of the jobs period.

 

[FarmerChick]

Land is not available to have enough small farms to handle our cities.

Hmmmm, whether you have 1500 (or whatever amount) cows on a farm or if you have them on several farms, the same amount of land is needed to produce the food for them.

what I mean is farm land right next to big cities like new york and los angeles. there isn't enough small farm acerage that could produce enough food to feed that city. it would still have to be trucked in from other larger farms from farther away that could provide the huge amts. required to feed millions of people.

example would be like ---When tractors were invented, did less horses sell to pull a plow? Did horse sales plummet cause cars were invented? Did less saddles have to be made? Did leathermen and horse dealers have less jobs? Did a blacksmith go out of business? Did hay sales drop? Were less horse shoes manufactured? Did the local livery stable close its doors? Did the wagon and buggy maker go out of business? and so on and so on for all that were affected?

I think the difference here is, the hores salesman, leathermen, etc. could retrain for a job that goes with what came with the new, in this example the car. That's not the same as what would happen if small farmers were replaced with cooperate farms. It's not a shift in the type of jobs available but, the availability of the jobs period.

I get ya on that one. BUT I don't think small farms will be replaced by big agri. corps. I think small farms will always be in business because of people like you and me. You have your farm but work outside the home also. We do too. There will always be small farm produce and products available. And glad about that.......all I am saying is that us small guys can not feed the world. We need the big agri. corps to fill in the blanks of millions and millions of tons of food to feed people.

and availability of jobs in this farming sector being lost is large, along with "how many retail" business firing people and never plan on rehiring. Or when the small local grocery closes its door because the big grocery chain came in....people adapt and I think is balanced. Small farms did and do have hard times just like any other business in this country.

Best type of situation is learn to adapt. Like CSA. Small farmers should ban together with their varying products, start stores locally, ship their products in unison and work as a team if they can. That is a way to ensure some safety....ban together and be as strong as 1 big corporation to stay in business. benefits all the farmers involved. Many of my farming publications push this type of thinking of course to help small farms stay in business.

Times change, simple as that. centuries have shown us that and it will continue to happen no matter the course we think it should proceed..LOL

 

[Frosting]

what I mean is farm land right next to big cities like new york and los angeles. there isn't enough small farm acerage that could produce enough food to feed that city. it would still have to be trucked in from other larger farms from farther away that could provide the huge amts. required to feed millions of people.

It would need to be trucked in whether from small farmers or large farmers so, why does it have to be large farms? Not saying they are all bad but, your pushing so for them and I'm interested in hearing why it seems you think it needs to be large farms instead of the smaller ones.

 

[FarmerChick]

what I mean is farm land right next to big cities like new york and los angeles. there isn't enough small farm acerage that could produce enough food to feed that city. it would still have to be trucked in from other larger farms from farther away that could provide the huge amts. required to feed millions of people.

It would need to be trucked in whether from small farmers or large farmers so, why does it have to be large farms? Not saying they are all bad but, your pushing so for them and I'm interested in hearing why it seems you think it needs to be large farms instead of the smaller ones.

LOL-LOL---WE MUST have argi. corps. Gee, ya know, millions upon millions to feed now????


1500 cows under a roof on 10 acres. a small farm can not do that (I mean the types of mom and pop like me, on limited funds etc)--- a small farm could not handle 1500 cows on 10 acres. It isn't doable. A large agri. corp. can do this by using row housing and automatic appliances and truck in tons and tons of feed from other large farms. It is a business that can be run efficiently IF the money is there to arrange this type of operation. 1500 cows on 10 acres outside los angeles would then be able to feed SOME of the population there. A small farm operation on 10 acres with some cows will never support the same as an agri. corp. can do with their technology at this point.

I am not pushing for them at all. I am saying they are needed, required, must have to feed the millions of people who DO want to eat. And if they must be here, then I applaud any step in a good direction for them to continue....cause they will have to continue. Agri. corps are needed...point blank or people would starve. It is not rocket science at all.

The way societies have grown, how they decided to live, with boxed cereals that require tons of corn, from homemade stove top stuffing which requires wheat and such.....all these products must have the basic ingredients from farming. And super million tons of it.

Now we can say don't eat that junk, and go back to real food from real gardens from real farmers...but we have surpassed that situation to where there is no real "going back" now and populations are increasing and people living longer. Simple supply and demand to feed millions.

So while they are needed, I want them to do a great job at it..LOL...and at no time do I want the little guy gone, heck the little guy is me, but I KNOW that agri. corps are needed and can't understand why so many people can't see the big picture here at all. (not referring to SS forum and that, I mean people in general all over the planet)

If anything, don't trash them and say they aren't needed, cause they ARE---....work with them on good improvements.

 

[Wifezilla]

I don't have a problem with them existing. I have a problem with them actively trying to crush any and all competition, using lobbyists to pass laws to hurt small farms, lying about their production methods, etc...

 

[FarmerChick]

I don't have a problem with them existing. I have a problem with them actively trying to crush any and all competition, using lobbyists to pass laws to hurt small farms, lying about their production methods, etc...

I agree...like any monstrosity, when it gets huge, it thinks it can rule the world. I hate that corp. attitude...quite a few have it!

but yea, lets change what we can for the good...best we can try to do!