So is the s*%t starting to hit the fan for you?

[freemotion]

Seems the young man, who used to be so helpful, thinks that working 40 hours a week entitles him to everything free here, including meals. NOT!!

That is called "renting" and costs a pretty penny. Send him a bill. Make a restaurant-style menu with prices, too, and add the gratuity to the bill! Remember your food is considered "gourmet" so price it accordingly! Oh, and a bill for cleaning service, too, and grounds maintainence.

 

[Up-the-Creek]

I have lived here for more than 30 yrs., in one of the poorest counties of the the second poorest state in th US. Mississippi is #1 poorest, WV #2, so I have never experienced the prosperity that you'all are apparently being separated from.

DH has always been a hard worker and a workaholic and has a good job, I don't work outside the home. In our own niche, I suppose that we are prosperous. We do not have high expectations. If you don't climb so high then you don't have very far to fall. I just made that up.

We live in a tourist service community and it has been unusally slow and quiet this summer.


Our stuff hit the fan in the 1950's when the coal mines began to close and the Companies that closed down and went elsewhere, left the people here permanently unemployed for about 3 generations. ( Service jobs and seasonal: food, lodging, ski-patrol, cashiers, bank tellers, crafts, and retirees, largest business here is the nursing home.)

What used to be one of the largest "company stores" is on the street that I live and I live in an old "company House" that can't be appreciated in value, and is unmarketable even in the best of times, because of the mine subsidence damage.

Average time it takes to sell a house in my town is 5 years. Very few, maybe one, has sold for, in excess of $100,000 for a long time.

I would say no to your ? for my part. (Because when The 'Stuff'HTF you will not have to ask, you will just know.)

I believe it will get much better for everyone eventually? I saw on the news that people are paying off much more of their debts now, and that is actually bad for business, but in the long term that could be a stabilizing factor, maybe???

From one WVian to another,.... Honestly though,..if you always have lived like the S'sHTF,..well you never notice too much when it does.

 

[DrakeMaiden]

DM - you mentioned a couple pages ago that some folks are still acting like its the same. i think "there in the bubble" its totally true - but even the folks i know there (and in hi-tech) are starting to finally notice how bad it is. a couple folks have said "so if its so bad why dont you just move back here" - HA! like i could even afford it anymore. but i heard that home prices are back to what they were in 2004 so.. hum... maybe.....

actually another friend from back there said that she hopes she can come here when everything goes.

i told her that "everybody plucks"... that keeps most of them away
;-)

2004 prices. I still consider that over-priced. Oh, right, that is the definition of bubble. Frankly, I don't think there is much worth moving back here to. Your assets now are land in a reasonable growing climate (warm summers, not as drought-prone as we in the West), and I would imagine a better community. If things got really bad, I wouldn't want to be in the Seattle area, for sure.

Don't forget to tell your friends that everyone wakes up at 5, eats dinner after the sun goes down, and goes to bed at 10, if they are lucky. That would stop most of them cold.

 

[MsPony]

My city is hyper inflated, and probably always will be. However I have noticed that one of customers with a black metal visa (which means you spend like $10k/week or something like that) is now using a standard debit card.

For me, its in waves like it always has been. I've always worked my butt off, since I was 12. I get paid a lousy $9/hr to scoop rabbit poo. I am under paid and under employed. But where is a smart person going to go with no college degree? Unfourtunately, even in ag around here, they look at degrees over experience. Which is funny, because I was hired @ my current job because I had a long list of horse jobs and the owner happens to love horses.

If SHTF entirely, ill be in deep doo doo. I can not support livestock in my backyard, 10 chickens is difficult enough. I can garden, but really I'm putting out apps for a farm to run to right now. I work for food and water!

But, thank god for SS! Its handy this month, fun next month

 

[Icu4dzs]

Around here, I see a lot of signs for short sales and for sale signs in general,

Just in case anyone is motivated to buy a house in these times, be absolutely avoidant of a "short sale". The banks are using that to entice buyers and then they slip language into a contract that allows them to raise the price without you agreeing to it. They are forcing the buyer to pay off the loan of the seller who wants to avoid foreclosure. E caveat emptor!!!

 

[ducks4you]

But where is a smart person going to go with no college degree? Unfourtunately, even in ag around here, they look at degrees over experience.

One of the DUMBEST people I've ever met was the farmer who rented me a turnout with shelter for my horses for 14 years. HIS father had numerous old chicken buildings and an egg business that supplied the twin cities (Champaign-Urbana, IL, population ~ 100K then) with most of their eggs. This son took over, built aginormous Morton Building, so big you can see it on a satellite, and within a year ran his father's business INTO THE GROUND!! BUT, he, unlike his father, had a 4 year AG degree. I have enough hours for almost a PhD, (232) but with only a Bachelor's and teacher certification, of which IL forced me take 100 additional hours to complete. The expression, "Those who can't, teach" is wholly applicable to a great many Professors at our many Universities. They are spoon feeding garbage to our youth. Their methods of practice in businesses only work when times are really good, which they are not. Any businesses which survive will be results oriented, of which YOU are expert, MsPony.

The only thing that I agree with FDR about is his famous quote: "The only thing we have to fear is fear itself." My wonderful MIL (now passed) was born into a pastor's family in 1920 and she grew up in rural Illinois. Her extended family were farmers and her uncle was a butcher. Her memories of the 1930's were of not getting new clothes every year. They ALL ate very well, thank you, if not extravagantly.
We'll all get through this, and be better stewards of what we have after it's over. I do not believe that we will have a full decade of depression. There are TOO many people who remember the Great Depression, and grew up modestly or had parents who lived through it, to be fooled by the crazy remedies Washington has come up with recently.

But, thank god for SS! Its handy this month, fun next month

Ditto.

 

[Damummis]

Things are still rolling here. At least for the next month or so. Then the town water gets shut off for the peninsula. The summer folks go home and my and DH's work gets cut by 75% till next summer. As far as the economy here, I really haven't noticed. Too busy harvesting, canning and freezing crops. Food stores will be full for the winter.

I kinda can't wait for the REAL SHTF. The grid going down or the economy crumbling will separate the survivors from the electronical folks (yes, I made that word up) . I love it when the power goes out. I find it humorous that everyone seems lost, not knowing what to do cause they have no electricity. Even the gas stations, who could run gas operated generators shut down.............the incompetence baffles me.

Anyway, I am ready, BRING IT ON!!!

 

[Icu4dzs]

This post came from a different string but fits here real well.

I don't know about y'all but this generic term SHTF doesn't really give us any clear perimeters as to how much "S" we are talking about. There are different degrees of "S" and some would be way more affected by the "S" than others....like city dwellers and such.

So.....what level of "S" are we talking about? Total system collapse? No utilities? No more fuel? No more going to work every day because there is no gas, no roads, no work place? Is everyone in the world in the same condition or is it a local "S" and only affects us temporarily? Is it a long term "S" with no easy solutions or is it a short term "S" that can be restored to previous conditions?

Inquiring minds wanna know......

Bee asks about what level of 'S', so I now want to explore the concept of "What is the 'S' made of"?

I posted this on a different string earlier. Seems as though it may be more germane to this discussion though. I have been putting a lot of thought into the concept of "just what are we talking about here when we say "TSHTF"?

Wifezilla imagines a scenario similar to what she describes as the Weimar republic. Certainly, that happened but we also know it happened once before. Are we so naive as to allow it to happen again?

One of the things I notice is that while a number of folks talk about TSHTF, they mention the S, but never seem to give any opinion or theory as to exactly the S will consist of and/or how it will affect all of us. Yes, we all have the wish to be either more SS or completely SS as much as possible. Both concepts give one the utmost in self-confidence and does wonders to minimize or actually eliminate many of the worries/anxiety most humans tend to possess.

To that end, I would like to hear exactly what folks think comprises the S and exactly how they expect to interact with the rest of the folks in not only their immediate surroundings but those of their fellow countrymen and the world for that matter.

It is hard enough to imagine that we, who profess the ss life style tend to believe that we would become "islands" in a sea of suffering and disaster and in some way compare ourselves to the story of the "Ant and the Grasshopper." In some way however, I think we all tend to realize that such isolation from others (who did NOT prepare for an emergency albeit atmospheric {and thus short} or cataclysmic {such as nuclear disaster} and thus quite long) would probably not be very successful nor would we be able to deal with the "brave new world" we will face effectively without the fear of interference from many more others than we had anticipated.

I have done quite a bit of reading on the subject and studied this for quite a long time and while the media and the "gloom/doom"sday "prophets" tend to try to make us think that a nuclear holocaust would not be survivable, the convention thinking (which makes great sense and to which I subscribe) is that it truly would be for many. http://www.survivalring.org/FEMA196-free.pdf

The concept of TEOTWAWKI is rather vague. In order to consider the end of the world as we know it, I suppose it is important to consider the true definition of TWAWKI at least as it applies to each of us. It is a completely different thing to each of us.

If we talk about "TWAWKI" we might as well be somewhat more realistic about it and consider that many WILL survive simply because they are either prepared and in an area that is NOT decimated by the actual destructive forces themselves (such as being near ground zero) or just lucky enough not to be killed but left with nothing. What will they do? How will they respond to the cataclysm that has occurred?

It is believed that a 500 kt bomb (as opposed to the size of the one used in Hiroshima which was 15 kt) would destroy pretty much every thing for a radius of about 9 miles. That is all. Yes, I realize that the density of the population in such an area makes that a horrific thought but the fact is, even a nuclear weapon is limited as to how much destruction it can cause. The farther away from such a devastating event obviously then increases the chances of survival for many, radioactive fallout, radiation poisoning, etc. not withstanding.

What then? Do we imagine the "Government" will come and solve our problems? (does anyone think they will survive it, too? Hellooo, Hurricaine Katrina anyone?)

So, then my question remains, what do we(the SS) aspirants THINK will really happen and how do we expect to interact with what we imagine will be the changes caused by TEOTWAWKI.

Will we attempt to involute and hide from others who didn't prepare? Will we band together and attempt to protect each other from those who didn't prepare or those who just seize the opportunity to take it from those who did prepare? Will we be able to start society back up again so that life continues, albeit somewhat different than it had been up to the "singularity" that we predict?

So, I guess to summarize my question, "What do you think the S is made of?"

Enquiring minds want to know...mine is among them.
Best to all

Trim sends

 

[AL]

I live in one of the poorest counties in my state. What recession?

I am extremely fortunate to have a very good job, with very good pay and very secure employment. I am extremely unfortunate that for 6 years of my "adult" life I lived strictly off of credit cards. What's not to love, right? you spend $1000 and just pay 20bucks a month?

About 5 years ago I "woke up" and realized I had over $40k in credit card debt, a brand new truck and nowhere to live. I bought a ragged out trailer - no heat, no AC, no stove- for $1500, gutted it and made do. Over time I have paid off 2 huge credit cards ($17k and $9k) and bought a new mobile home with heat and air (friends made fun of me when I say "I cranked the heat up to 56"). I still have trouble saving money, so I opened a certificate and also gave my dad (77yrs old) some money to jar up for me.

I planted a small garden for the first time this year - about 40'x60' - as well as more fruit trees, some blackberries (not counting the 4 gal yield I got from wild berries) , raspberries and blueberries. I have 15 laying hens and a roo. I live next door to my parents who have pecan trees, pear trees, fig trees and citrus trees.
My mom has been teaching me to can.... but all we were able to do this year was preserves (figs, blueberries, storebought strawberries) because my tomatos rotted on the vine. We have 2 dogs - 1 huge scary looking one, and 1 medium sized "you'd be wise to be scared of him" mutt. My dad has firearms, I don't yet.

We had a 'minor' SHTF in '04 when Hurricane Ivan hit, demolishing the interstate bridges to the east and west and also cutting off the evacuations to the north. The Gulf of Mexico sits to our south. We never even noticed how long the gov't took to get here, because we were prepared to fend for ourselves.


My main concern is for my parents - fixed income, major medical issues and bills for my mom and rising costs of everything.

 

[old fashioned]

It's been kinda tough around here. Several houses either empty, for sale or for rent. Some have been sold and others have been put on the market. Alot of people underemployed, including us.

As for us personally, we've been on a slow yet steady decline. Last year our money situation just kept getting tighter & tighter, so I got a job (after 10 years as SAHM). About a month later DH's job cut his hours from 40 to 32. That's not much, but it sure has hurt us anyway and my job pays less than half what he makes and my hours fluctuate from 16 to 36 per week.
In November, DH had to have cataract surgery on one eye and will soon have to have surgery on the other one and we'll have to pay approx $3600 out of pocket for copays & deductables for both eyes.
Then of course in December when DH was SUPPOSED to get a third paycheck, his boss said they were closing for two weeks for the holidays. It was great when he went back to work after the first of the year, but then he didn't work today & won't tomorrow either. I can only hope he'll go back Wednesday.
At this rate, I'm not sure how much longer we'll be able to keep our house. The last several months we've been really scraping by to keep up with our bills. At one point we had cancelled phone & internet & tried to cancel TV too but are under contract until April. We quickly realized we hadn't planned the transition to life 'unhooked' very well so for now we're 'up & running' again, atleast for now.
And we've been eating more out of our pantry/freezer than before & haven't been replacing it. I still do grocery shopping, but only buying more of what we need now-NOT stocking up. I realized I didn't have as much stocked up as I thought.

DH & I were talking tonight about the hard realities of his job & the possibility the company may shut down. Something he hasn't wanted to admit in the past but is now realizing the eventual possibility, even though his boss says they aren't but will admit to struggling financially. If they do close, we are surely SOL. Although I'm not sure what is worse, to be 'all of a sudden' SHTF or this slow agonizing drain.