Beekeeping...for those interested!

[me&thegals]

That's a great idea, Homesteadmom! We have a guy who goes through our land to get to our hives and in exchange gives us a year's worth of honey. Still, I'd like to raise our own.

Good points, too, on the pollination and boosting bee populations. Last year, our bee guy didn't get his bees back in the hives until late spring (he must pull them in winter, maybe for renting to orchards in spring?) and we were not seeing pollinators until really late in the season. Maybe that's why we're not really getting anything on our fruit trees? It would also be interesting to see if my vegetable production would go up.

I've also heard the allergies/local honey thing. We use it for irritated throats or coughs and it truly works.

 

[Homesteadmom]

Thanks, I am hoping that dh would see it is not as bad as he thinks it will be & then we can get into having all our own bees & hives. What better way to show a sceptic than to show them first hand.

 

[homestead jenna]

Here is an interesting article about honey bees and alternative pollinators:

http://entomology.ifas.ufl.edu/sanford/apis/papers/altpol.htm

I didn't realize just how much money is in this whole honeybee thing in the application of agriculture, but I knew it was big. Just not that big!

We were told at our class on Saturday that there aren't enough bee colonies in the entire country to meet the demand for pollinators for almond trees in California. He was a state apiary inspector and he inspects hives that are being brought through the state on their way West.

Many botanicals don't benefit from more and more pollinating but almonds do apparently. AND....apparently almonds have become an "investment" rather than a product.

Supposedly bees are much more "lucrative" as pollinators than they are for the honey or even the beeswax.

 

[the simple life]

Pollinating the almond orchards can be very rough on the bees and can weaken the colonies. Many times they sell the bees right after pollination.
There is alot of debate surrounding this practice.
I understand that orchards need their crops pollinated but I wouldn't send my bees down there.
I heard one guy on a forum the other day say that he kills off his bees after pollination. Use em and kill em.
He stated his financial figures and said how much he saves by not over wintering his bees. He uses them for pollination and kills them and buys new ones in the spring which he says is cheaper.
They use to do that years ago as a regular practice but its apparently still going on.
I don't consider this man a beekeeper as much as I view him as a bee pimp.
I think people can go too far with using their bees and its almost exploitation in a way.
I think its a good idea to use the wax and honey but I don't even like the idea of collecting the pollen from the bees, it can be tough on them going through the pollen collector and I think they work hard enough as it is.
You could conceiveably use every single resource from the hive, honey, wax, propolis and pollen(commercial people can use royal jelly and bee venom as well) and then rent them out for pollination to the big guys.
You can exploit them to the max.
Some beekeepers take away every drop of honey and feed them sugar water and leave them with nothing they worked for.

I am just happy to get some left over honey that they don't need, hopefully they pollinate my garden and I can enjoy watching them come and go.
That is enough for me.

 

[MyGardenHelper]

Very sad...from what I understand, most of the bee crisis is because of california. It was eeiry 2 years ago when I didn't see any bees in my garden. They finally started appearing last summer. This is when I became interested in becoming a bee keeper. We have a lot of wineries in my area, but pesticides are used, so I hope my bees don't go there. There's only one winery at the bottom of our hill. I should find out what practice they use. I'm hoping to provide them enough flowers, etc. organically that they won't need to travel. Honey would be great, but I'm more interested in just seeing more bees...and healthy bees.

Does anyone know more about the bee crisis and what started it?

 

[me&thegals]

I think it has been credited with many possible causes, including such possibilities as genetically modified crops.

 

[Dace]

Bee Pimp made me laugh...I know it is not funny though.

I just read an article about droves of comercial beekeepers bringing hives into the almond groves. I had no idea it was such big business.

Very sad to hear about someone using then killing off one of Gods creatures for profit. What is the matter with people?

 

[me&thegals]

Welcome to agribusiness, where the bottom line is the main concern.

 

[me&thegals]

I talked to our local bee guy. He has had terrible heart problems, is 70 years old, now wheelchair bound (for now) due to his heart problems and doesn't know if he will bring the bees back. At last half were sold to California.

So, I hoped to have more time to research this but I might have to kick it all into high gear. I would gratefully appreciate any help on a couple questions:

1. How crucial is it to get new frames and boxes? In one of my books, it says never for any reason use old, for disease prevention reasons.

2. How little $ could a person spend to get set up with 2 colonies, maybe 4 boxes?

3. The books tell about all the diseases, predators, and every thing that could go wrong. If I read gardening books and had never gardened, I would be too afraid to garden based on all the bugs and possible diseases. As a gardener, I know this is not actually usually the case. For you current beekeepers out there, how prevalent are diseases, parasites and other problems?

4. How much time does good beekeeping take? Is it seasonal? Weekly?

For anyone who takes the time to answer these questions, thank you so much! I'm also doing my very best to connect up with a couple friends who do this--just a matter of time and scheduling. Some things are hard to learn from a book!

 

[the simple life]

Some others might chime in on this, but I would never use old beekeeping equipment myself. Disease is very prevalent and you don't want to buy someone else's problems, at least now being ne at it and risking contracting something to your new colonies that you are not familiar with.
There is alot to learn and buy, thats why I started purchasing equipment last year.
I know that no one would ever advise you to use old frames.
Boxes you can use a blow torch and scorch the wood to kill organisims and any mites that could be hiding in the cracks.
As far as how prevalent disease is, its everywhere and you have no way of knowing what that guy has had in his boxes.
I know that there have been very heavy losses on some of my forums this year, even seasoned beekeepers who do everything right have their colonies die from time to time, it happens.
There is no way of telling, too many variables.
I am assuming that he is using 10 frame boxes, do you know if they are deeps or mediums?
Have you decided if you are going with all deep brood boxes and medium and shallow supers or are you planning to do all mediums for brood boxes and supers, it saves alot of headache having everything one size.That way everything is interchangeable and you aren't scrambling for an extra super when you need it.
You can also move frames from the brood box to a super if they are all mediums, you can't do that if you have deeps, mediums and shallows.
If you are doing 10 frame boxes they are going to weigh more than 8 frame boxes. One ten frame deep box weighs 100 lbs when full.
That is alot of heavy lifting when you will be lifting multiple boxes.
A medium is half that.
How much is this guy actually giving you for free? Is it even worth it? You could buy a new set up and not worry about his equpiment not being the size you want or harboring disease.
Does it come with a stand? inner and outer cover? a screened bottom board? feeder? if not this is all stuff you are going to need.
2 boxes, which I think you mean the brood boxes might get you going but you will need supers on top for the honey. If you don't give them enough room to expand they will leave.
If you do mediums then you will need 5 supers, 3 for brood and 2 for honey, just to start with.
You can't start with just 2.
You really should find out what he plans to supply you with.

Prices vary somewhat to purchase bees in different areas.
I have seen nucs go for between 80.00-125.00 this year so if you want 2 then figure between 160.00 and 250.00 just for the bees.
If you buy packages they are cheaper but you don't get the frames of brood and food, they go around 70.00 -80.00 each.
You should join your local bee club and get some help, get your name on a list for when someone catches a swarm.
Its possible that you could catch one and get free bees but, that is very unreliable and you could end up with nothing.
You can only purchase bees for maybe another month or so. The guy I ordered mine from is already sold out.

So, assuming he is going to give you an entire set up, you will at the very minimum going to need frames, 10 per box so say 50 frames per hive. 100 frames for 2 hives.
If you get them unassembled you can get them for around 35.00 for 50 frames so plan on 70.00 for 2 hives.

Are you doing foundation? If so you have to buy that too, not sure what that will cost but assume around 30.00 for 50 sheets so times that by 2 and it will cost approx 60.00 .
This is without shipping by the way, I have no idea what shipping is to your area.
So you are at approx. 130.00 for frames and foundation.

Then for the supers, if you get them unassembled, ballpark of 10.00 each depending on size a little less or a little more, so 50.00 for that-- $100.00 for 2 colonies( again no idea on the shipping)
So you are at $230.00 now.
Then for the bees, say around 80.00 cheapest, if you buy 2 colonies you are at $390.00

This is hard if you don't know if he is giving you the rest of the stuff.
We just discussed this at a recent bee club meeting and they estimated around $500.00 to get going with one colony for the first year with equpiment and bees.

I know that when I bought my hives each one cost 150.00 ( not including shipping) for the equipment and then a nuc is 80.00-115.00 in my area.

So brand new, if you got 2 hives with bees, approximately$500.00.
Then you need a smoker, hive tools, protective clothing, (gloves, veil, jacket or suit) entrance reducer, mouse guard,etc.

I don't really know what to say, I am not sure how you can get away with making it cheaper to start out with.
Its not something I personally would jump into without getting more prepared but you may do okay.
I would get a mentor if I were you, you will need someone to support you if you are jumping right into it.
I signed up for 2 bee schools and belong to 2 bee clubs, I have now read like 20 books and I subscribe to 2 magazines and get mulitple catalogs to compare prices.
I started buying my equipment over a year ago because its too much money to do all at once.
There are alot of expensive mistakes to be made if you don't plan ahead and decide how you want to proceed with your beekeeping.
What size you want to go with and what method you want to use.

Its tough to figure what the cheapest you can get away with if you don't know what he is supplying you with. Is it an entire hive and is it in good condition or rotting apart?
Figure on spending at least $500.00 to set up 2 colonies if you get some of the stuff for free, more money(maybe 800.00-1000.00 if you are not getting an entire hive set up.
If it were me I would buy new stuff and not take on someone else's old equipment if I don't know the deal.
Find out what he is giving you, size and condition the stuff is in and then compare it to a list of equpiment that you will need.
You will have to figure out what else you need and where you plan on getting the bees from.