honey bees, how to start

[Sebrightmom]

I would leave the queen in the box, if it was me. THe reason I would is because if she dies before she is out of the box, you can prove it. One of my hives killed their queen so I had to get another one. She was still in the box. Sometimes the bees won't like the queen.

 

[the simple life]

you may want to be careful with those entrance feeders, they induce robbing.
I use mine for water but won't feed them syrup with them.
I have both types of bee hives, the langs and the topbars.

If I were you I would put that entrance feeder inside the hive and keep the front entrance reduced to the minimum while the package builds up a little and can defend itself from robbers.
You have italians that have the reputation of being more prone to robbing than other races of bees.

If you have an extra follower board you can cut a groove out of the bottom to put the entrance feeder behind it with just the opening sticking through to the side of the hive where you are keeping the bees while they build up.

An easier way to feed topbar hives is the baggie method
Fill a gallon size ziploc bag with syrup(don't over fill it) and seal it up, lay it on the floor of the hive and put a couple of slits in the top.
Let a little dribble out so the bees find it.

You can also use smaller size bags if you want, just keep an eye on their reserves.

As far as sprinkling sugar on the floor, I would not do that.
I would only feed them straight granulated sugar if it was an emergency situation as in they are starving and can't get to their feeder due to the cold.
They can't use that as readily as syrup, they need water to make it digestable.
Not only that, you are attracting ants.

Many people direct release the queen when its in a topbar but thats up to the individual.

You can hang it off of a bar by wire or you can lay it on the floor.
If the queen has been in the package with them for a few days you could loosen the plug a little bit and then put the cage in and let them do the rest.
You have a topbar hive so you will not be hanging the cage off of the center frame, you need to do it more towards one end of the hive because you normally have a follower board in place that will be cutting off some of the hive to them while they build up.

I would not rush things because you can jeapordize her acceptance and if you have to order another queen you will put them behind.

I don't know how big your hive is but you either need to use a follower or leave some of the bars out of the hive.

Mine have 33 bars in each and I am only giving them 10-12 to start off with.
You feed in the bars as needed.

Good luck with your bees.
I was excited to get mine as well.
I got my first ones a couple of weeks ago and have been getting the others as they are ready.

I have 10 hives of New World Carniolan, Russian, Purvis Goldline, and some already regressed survivor stock that was overwintered here in New England.
I am doing all foundationless frames=-natural comb in medium
hives or topbars.

 

[me&thegals]

Simple life-We have missed you!!! You always give me such excellent advice!

I think I will do the baggy syrup method in one and the jar feeder behind the follower board on the other.

I have 4-foot top bar hives, 1.25" bars the whole length, observation windows on the sides. Do you have an opinion on how much space I should give them next to the entrance while they work on building up? I will put the cut-down follower board immediately in front of the real follower board, just leaving enough room for the feeder. Does that sound right? How about a 2-gallon baggie? I don't want to suit up and smoke them every time I need to refill their food...

I think I will loosen the plug, as you say. I know they're coming from down south, but I don't actually know how long it has taken them to get here. I'm assuming a couple days. Honestly, the guy at Dadant has such terrible customer service skills that he has me terrified to ask him a single other question.

Does anybody use bee food like Megabee or others? I guess as a newbie I'm susceptible to false advertising, but they claim to help a hive build up much more quickly.

TSL--I'm so excited for you! You really started off with a bang We would love to hear how your bees do and how each type of hive box works for you. I'm really excited for the kids and I to be able to watch these bees build their own wax. Even have the Epi-Pens refilled so my husband can be in on the action, too

Was installing a breeze? Can you stay unprotected for this part? Is it really as simple as thumping the box on the ground to get them to drop to the bottom, then dumping them in the hive?

I was going to leave about 1" for entrance. Does this sound about right?

Thanks so much! It would be hard to tell, but I actually have read extensively about this. I guess I just want the reassurance of doublechecking on a few things since today is the day and it's a pretty sizable investment.

Again, best of luck to you!

 

[me&thegals]

One more question: What is your syrup recipe? Whenever I see one, it never says whether the ratio is measured in volume or weight. Thanks,

me&thegals

 

[the simple life]

You are so excited that you make me smile while I am reading your posts.

Thanks for the thoughts, I have had alot going on, my daughter and son were both in the hospital. Another son just broke his hand. My sister had heart problems and my dad just had surgery for cancer.
Then on top of that I am just trying to get things done here with the garden and coop and the bees.

So here is my best shot.

A 2 gallon bag is fine or you can use 2 smaller ones, whichever you prefer.
Just know that if they don't take all of it because your nectar flow comes on the baggies are messy to remove because of the slits but you should be fine for a while because you really need to feed a package for a while for them to build up.

I was told to start them off with a 1:1 ratio of sugar and water to start them off when doing topbar hives as they need alot to produce all that wax.
It also helps to jumpstart brood rearing.

Then I was told for other feedings to do a 2:1 ratio water being 2 and sugar being 1.
Just heat the water in a pan, you do not need to bring it to a full boil, just hot enough that you can dissolve the sugar into it.
You can let it cool to luke warm and then give it to them.
I don't make enough at a time to have to store it but they say just to refrigerate any extra and then reheat it so its not ice cold and then give it to the bees.
I figure if I am going to go through the bother of heating it up in a pan then I may as well just make a batch as I need it.

If they are taking their syrup slowly it can get moldy.
I have been told that you can add a tablespoon of vinegar to a couple of gallons to prevent that.

As far as the mega patties, I know they are hyped up and it makes you think you need to buy them but the latest research as proven that alot of those patties attract small hive beetles.
The grease patties that beeks use to make up out of grease and granulated sugar to combat tracheal mites are attractive to hive beetles as well so I just would not bother.

Remember to never feed your bees honey or pollen from any other source but their own hives.
Too much risks involved with spreading disease.

Come fall you should leave your bees the minimum of the equivalent of one bar of honey per one bar of bees to get through the winter.

So if your colony covers 4 bars of comb then you need to leave them 4 bars of comb, 6 bars for 6 bars etc.
You can and should leave them more if possible but thats the minimum you should leave.
You can always harvest the rest in the spring when they don't need it anymore.

There are alot of topbar keepers that don't harvest anything in the summer and fall and just wait until spring to collect their rent.
If your bees are doing well then you may be able to harvest a bar or two this year.
See how you feel about it, playing it safe never hurts but its also nice to get a little honey.

I would probably give them 10 bars to start, but keep any eye on them so they don't run out of room and then feed bars into the middle of the brood nest.

After you hive them you can check back in a couple of days to make sure the queen has been released.
If she is still in the cage then release her and close up the hive and leave them alone for a week.
After a week or so check in on them to see how things are going, if there is any comb that is not right you need to correct it now so they do not follow the pattern of a crazy comb.
If they make cross comb where they attach comb across 2 bars then try to carefully pull it off and reattach it to the correct comb, its very soft and pliable so just push it into place.
If its not salvagable just cut it off and let them start over.
If you have some that looks good then you can put some empty bars in between so they can use the correct ones as guides.

As far as hiving the bees, you never know how their demeanor is going to be but I never hear any real terrible stories of beekeepers getting attacked or anything.
If you have protective gear its a good idea to wear it , you never know how they will react plus if you feel confident you will be more relaxed and make less mistakes.
Confidence plays a role in how things go, if you aren't suited up you may start rushing through it and if you get stung you con't want to drop anything.

Having said that I did not have any protective gear when I got my first 2 hives because my order got caught up and did not arrive in time.
I did not wear anything, including gloves.
I was putting in nucs so it was a matter of moving frames.
Nothing happened, it could not have gone better, I lucked out.
I have my gear now though and will wear it for inspections since they get more aggressive when they have honey and brood to protect.
So if you have it I would wear it, plus then you will look really cool, like an official beekeeper in the really cool hat and veil.

Don't sweat anything, remember this is suppose to be a fun hobby and everyone makes mistakes.
On top of that you will get so much advice from people that will contradict everything else you have been told.
Just follow your instinct and let the bees tell you what they need.
They know what they need more that we do.
Get yourself a nice comfy chair and sit in front of the hive and watch bee tv.
You can learn alot by sitting in front of a hive, plus its so relaxing.
I watch them fly in with their legs loaded up with orange, yellow and white pollen and look around to figure out where they are getting it from.
You can see the guard bees manning the entrance, young bees taking their orientation flights and the lazy bees sunning themselves on the landing board.

 

[me&thegals]

Thank you so much! Some of the forum info on the beek sites assume a pretty advanced knowledge of terminology and hives, which I don't have. So, your information is very easy to understand.

I hope your family is doing better--what a stressful spring! I hope it all calms down for you now and you can enjoy all you have growing and living around you.

me&thegals

 

[the simple life]

Your are very welcome, I know what you mean by how confusing it can be when you start out and everyone talks like you have been doing this for years and you have no idea what they are talking about.
It will come and you will love beekeeping.

Thanks for your nice thoughts, its been really crazy here but everyone is on the mend and things are getting done outside so I am hoping to be caught up on everything by the end of the month.
Its just nuts how everything happens at once, one child gets home from the hospital and the next day another child ends up in the hospital, which means I lived at the hospital since I wouldn't leave anyone.
While I am there with my daughter in the treatment area of the ER my sister gets wheeled by on a gurney having a heart attack.
It was surreal, I was like how can all this be happening at once?
So we get home and start to get back to normal and my father has to have surgery and then my son broke his hand the same day.

It was alot at once with some close calls, but everyone is recovering and I am very grateful for that so I will get down to the business of living and enjoying life with my kids and my husband.

Everything is coming together right now, all the chickens are laying and the bees are busy, I doubled the size of the garden and I have a table at the farmer's market.
Actually the other night someone at my bee club approached me because she knows I sell eggs and she asked me to sell them from her farm as well.
She just got a new flock and none are laying yet so so she wants me to do it for the rest of the year.
Would you believe that she sells eggs for $6.00 per dozen and her customers don't bat an eye so thats what she wants me to price mine for?
I may need more chickens.

 

[reinbeau]

Five pounds of sugar to one gallon of water is the correct ratio for syrup for new packages. Easy to remember, easy to make.

 

[me&thegals]

Well, they're installed. The whole family was out watching, and there were only 5 stings between the 4 of us

I wish I could do it over, so I guess this will be a constant learning experience. I wasn't prepared for how many bees would be clinging to the queen when I pulled her cage from the box. These cages had cork plugs that had to be removed, then quickly stuffed with a marshmallow. A bit difficult with gloves, so I removed it for the second hive.

I was also shocked at how many bees there are in 3#. After my husband and kids got stung in the first installation, I got a little skittish and left probably too many bees in the box to find their way out. Second installation was better, less nerve wracking.

I suspended the queens in the middle of the top bar hive, leaving the front open for me to dump in the colony. Then, immediately behind the false back, I have the mason jar feeder, just the feeder area inside the bees' part of the box.

Also, I think my syrup mixture was considerably thicker than Ann's above recommendation. They seemed to be really taking it in, though, when we were brushing their cages with it.

Overall, it was an incredible experience. It was delightful to see the whole family so enthralled with the whole process. I'm amazed at the bees already. Somehow (is it the queen? the sugar inside?) they know to find their way into this wooden box that we have decided they must live in. Incredible.

I imagine there will be a worn trail between my house and the 600 or so yards to their boxes. We have observation windows, so they are going to be spied on quite a bit this spring

Does anybody else have that twitchy, crawly sensation of having a bee or 2 trapped inside their clothing? I'm still crawling!

One more question--Lots is blooming here. Will some go out to forage? Or, do they need to have comb built first to have a place to store?

me&thegals

 

[the simple life]

Congratulations it sounds like you did great!

Don't worry about the mixture being a little thick.
A gallon of water to 5lbs of sugar is a little thinner because a gallon of water is around 8 lbs.

You are using a topbar hive and the bees need to build all those combs from scratch so its recommended by the topbar hive beekeeping forums/sites to do the 1:1 after installation.

So its usually suggested that you mix 1 lb of sugar to l pint of water.

With topbars you want to get them to build comb and not stimulate brood rearing since the queen would have no where to lay yet with out the comb.

After they get things underway it can be changed but hopefully by then you would have a good nectar flow and not be needing to feed them anymore but if you do you can follow the chart below.

Its always good to ask other beekeepers in your area if and when they start feeding so you will know in the future when to start and stop. It can vary from one place to another depending on the weather, temps etc.
Its good to use local beeks as a gage in what to do sometimes.
Hopefully you can find someone else who is doing the topbar hives locally as well so you have someone to compare notes with.

This is a chart that demonstrates the amounts.

1:2 is 1 pound of sugar dissolved in 2 pints of water. This is a Spring mixture used to stimulate the queen to start laying.
1:1 is 1 pound of sugar dissolved in 1 pint of water. This is a mixture used to encourage comb building.
2:1 is 2 pounds of sugar dissolved in 1 pint of water. This is a Fall mixture used to make winter stores.

Your bees will be out foraging before you know it.
I hived mine early evening and they were out doing orientation flights the next day and the day after that they were coming in loaded with pollen.
You will not believe how fast they can build comb from scratch.
When you check to see if the queen is released in a couple of days don't panic if they haven't got much comb built, they are taking in the syrup for wax production.
By the time you do your first inspection they should be getting going.
After 2 weeks mine had several combs fully built and they were filled with eggs and brood in various stages along with full frames of capped brood.
I love the brand new freshly built white wax and the way the bottom of natural comb is curved.

Remember that you can't tilt natural comb or it will snap off the bar because its so new and soft, the weight of it will cause it to break.
Rotate your frames so that the comb is facing up on the bar or down on the bar but do not hold it downwards and then tilt the bar outwards like you are pointing with it, the weight will break it off.
I hope I am not confusing you too much but its hard to explain without actually showing you what I mean with the comb.

To inspect the comb pull it out of the box straight up and if you need to turn it make sure you go from the downward pointing postion to slowly turning it so that the comb is now to your left and then upwards and then your right to back down.
Never hold it so that the comb is pointing out in front of you.

As far as the feeling of a bee crawling up your pant legs, I have had that too, its weird that you feel that way even though you know they aren't there.

I meant to tell you that if all the bees do not leave the package you can pull one topbar out of the hive and place the opening of the package over it so the bees move down on their own.
No big deal since you already did the installation but just for future reference.
In a pinch you can also do that with a nuc if for some reason you need to and don't want to deal with cutting out comb and tying it onto the topbars.
A package is the easiest way to go with the topbar hives though but you never know when someone wants to give you a free nuc, it just happened to me tonight at my bee club meeting as a matter of fact.

Well, I am happy that everything went so well for you and you and your family are going to get so much enjoyment out of this hobby.
My 6 year old son just completed a beekeeping course at our club and he has his own hive and his own gear.
He is just ecstatic over it, he won a hive tool at the club and you would have thought it was a million dollars.
Its nice to see kids enjoying something other than the electronic world they live in.
He always asks me now if I want to go watch the bees with him and we both sit in front of the hives on a couple of big rocks I put there for that purpose.
Its such a peaceful time watching the bees going in and out and marveling at how much pollen some of them can stuff into those leg baskets and how some of them are so laden with it they can barely fly into the hive.
We look at the different color pollen they bring in and try to figure out which source it came from.
Lots of fun just hanging out together and watching the bee world go by.
Its amazing how much kids can learn when its a hands on thing like this.