honey bees, how to start

[the simple life]

When you add bars you can add them to different areas depending on what you want to accomplish.

For a new hive after they have built out the combs you have given them you can give them the same amount so if they have 10 bars give them 10 more.

After they fill that next group give them all the rest at once.

If you have all your bars in the hive just move the follower board back.

If the feeder is in the way then you won't be able to put all the bars in at once but when you do need to and if they still need to be fed then you can use the baggie method.

When you add bars you can put them behind the existing combs or if they seem congested because you waited too long to add combs then feed them directly into the brood nest to break it up and prevent them from swarming.

If they don't have comb to constantly build the workers will have nothing to do and the queen will not have anywhere to lay and thats when they get ready to swarm.

This is especially true in a topbar hive due to less area.
You can also feed a comb into the brood nest to get straight comb if thats where it is.

If you ever get a really crazy comb get rid of it or they will copy it.
Once they build a comb they will copy the one directly next to it and it causes a domino effect which can be either good or bad depending on the comb.

 

[me&thegals]

We all went out tonight to check the queens. I used just a mask, wish I hadn't spent money on those gloves since I can't work at all with them. I puffed smoke into their entrances, opened up the back end and refilled the syrup. They were WAY down, about 2/3 for one, 1/3 for the other. Unfortunately, there was a huddle of bees that got stuck in the back of the hives that I had to try to brush back where they belonged.

Then, we found the queens were out. In one hive, there was comb hanging down already! One was about the size of my hand! What a beautiful sight--all creamy white, U-shaped and in perfect alignment with the bars. Can't wait to get in there again and try to get everything situated better. Some bars are still cockeyed. There was a storm coming on and I couldn't get the bars in without crushing bees.

Does it matter that they started building next to the follower board, near the feeder? Is there a reason why I would want their brood nest in the front (entrance side) of the hive?

Thanks,

me&thegals

 

[the simple life]

Sounds like the girls are doing awesome!
I am glad the syrup worked out for you, they have alot of comb to build from scratch and they need it.

Quite often they will build their brood nest near the entrance for some reason but Michael Bush told me that if they don't its not a big deal, they know what they need to do.
I have heard different people mention all different locations of where the brood nest is.
It may be that they want their brood nest away from the entrance for warmth.

Bees are such unpredictable creatures.

The only issue I can think of is when they start building from the follower board towards the entrance they will run out of room and want to swarm, but you can control that by adding in bars before they get to the end.
If that starts to happen I would feed a couple of bars into the brood nest and on the end and open up another 10 bars behind the follower, just move the follower back 10 bars or so.
If the queen does not have anywhere to lay the nurse bees don't have anything to do and everyone gets antsy and they prepare to swarm so just keep an eye on their room.

If you want you can add a bar next to the follower and see which way they go.

If you can, fit some bars in the back where the feeder is just in case they get back there again and start building burr comb.
Building comb that you have to rip out is a waste of energy and resources.
If you give them a place to build it won't be as bad but hopefully the small amount of bees that get back there won't do much anyway.

I didn't buy those gloves because they seem to big and bulky to work with .

If I wear gloves at all I wear the nitrile medical gloves.
They keep your hands from getting sticky but decent ones offer sting protection.

You can get them at medical supply places, the hardware store, pharmacies and online. ( or your doctor's office)

The thicker ones offer the most protection and you get can long ones( I think elbow length) online as well.
The only thing about some of the gloves are that dark colors like purple or turquoise seem to be sold alot and they say you are better off with lighter colors around bees.

Having said that I have worn dark purple ones because I got them for free and did not have a problem.

Disposable gloves are good to have onhand for a few reasons, if you need extra gloves when showing someone your hives or if your kids want to help, visiting other people's hives, working with honey and propolis gets you all sticky and you can just peel them off and go to the next hive and it keeps from spreading disease.

Your leather gloves can harbor germs that can be spread from one hive to another.

Nitrile gloves may not be completely sting proof but offer alot more protection than if you didn't use anything at all.

Check out this site and you will get an idea.
The thicker the better, some offer more thickness than others in the fingers, some offer textured fingers for better grip etc.

https://www.envirosafetyproducts.com/category/Nitrile-Disposable-Gloves.html

 

[me&thegals]

The only issue I can think of is when they start building from the follower board towards the entrance they will run out of room and want to swarm, but you can control that by adding in bars before they get to the end.
If that starts to happen I would feed a couple of bars into the brood nest and on the end and open up another 10 bars behind the follower, just move the follower back 10 bars or so.

How about just scooting the entire bar cluster containing the brood nest up to the entrance and then sticking all the empty bars behind them?

Also, when I had to move the cluster of bees apart to get out the queen cages, it seemed difficult and I felt badly pulling about their living chain. Any repercussions for doing this, for example to stick some more empty bars into their brood nest?

How full does the entry need to be before I decide to open it up a bit more? How built up should the hive be before I do the same? And how can I tell? Will it be really obvious once new bees start hatching out? Is hatching even the right word?

Thanks!

me&thegals

btw: Natalie--ANY details you are willing to take the time for on your top bars would be greatly appreciated.

Especially:

1. Entry--where, how big, more than one?

2. Initial allotted space using follower board.

3. Ventilation.

4. Solid bottom, screened, other?

Thanks again!

 

[the simple life]

Oh my gosh, I didn't realize I missed your last post!

The entry can be either on the end or on the sides.
Just avoid putting them on each end and have the wind blow through.
You can open your entrances to the full amount once the package is developing and going in and out alot.
Otherwise you will have a traffic jam.

There are people who say the ends are best and then there are people who say the side is best.

I think an entrance at the front and one or two holes in the side are a good idea.
It gives them a couple of different options as to where they want to unload their pollen/nectar at.
If you drill a hole the size of a cork or dowel in the side just make sure you do it in between the bars so that they aren't trying to come in and being blocked by a comb or do it low enough they can duck under.

For the intitial space, if you give them several bars and they fill them out 75 percent, give them the same amount and once they fill out 75 percent of those then open up the whole hive.
At this point if you are still feeding you can take the feeder out and use the baggie method.

I asked Michael Bush about ventilation and a screened bottom board and he felt it was unneccesary.
He said the point of tbh is the simplicity of it but if I wanted to put one in it would be okay too.

If you plan on doing sugar shakes to control varroa then a screened bottom board would allow the sugar and varroa to fall through.
One thing I keep hearing is that varroa cannot survive/reproduce in higher temperatures and that the screened bottom boards may actually be aiding them in that it keeps the hive cooler.
I am going without the screened bottoms this year and will see about next year.
Usually your first year you will be free of varroa, its the second year they can hit you.
I am going to test the theory of higher temps in the tbh.
Also, when there is a screened bottom board its good to have something to keep it closed such as a wooden bottom that latches back on so you close it after you dust the hive.

If you don't have something to close it there would be way to much ventilation.
Its different in a lang hive because their entire hive isn't sitting over the screen like a tbh colony is.
In the lang they can move up.

 

[me&thegals]

As always, thank you I posted on beemaster.com also. After a lot of rainy days, my observation window has fogged up. I'm propping the back end of the cover but will need to get some ventilation holes. Someone on beemaster suggested drilling a ventilation hole on the other side or end but stapling hardward cloth over it to not have multiple entrances. Sounds good. Would I leave that open in winter? I keep reading that moisture is more of an issue for bees than cold. But, you also seem to be saying that the bees might appreciate several entrances for bringing home the goodies...

I have a solid bottom board and will stick with that.

I really got them started messed up. In my inexperience on first installation, I left the front unbarred, which is why they had to start the brood nest back towards the follow board. Some bars got left in crooked and spaced out, some not put in at all. Duh! Anyway, they had a grand old time building comb. Most of it is actually pretty good. Some bars have 2 sheets on each edge, but perhaps they will join it at the middle. Because of this mess, some fell off while I was trying to pull out the bar to look for the queen. That is now being attached to the bottom of the hive. I will have to clean that out next time I'm in.

Have you found your queens, Natalie? Seen eggs? Not yet here...

Well, back to work

me&thegals

 

[the simple life]

Bummer, I hadn't realized that you didn't have all the bars in front of the follower board. They will definitely do crazy stuff when there is too much space.

I thought you had the bars in and then the follower and wanted to know how many more to add when they were almost full.
Michael Bush doesn't even bother with any formal entrances on his hives, he just pushes all the bars back and props the cover or takes one bar out and props the cover.
I like to have my regular entrances, he does what he does because of mice and skunks but he keeps his hives very close to the ground.

As long as you can cover your entrances when you want it does not really matter where you put them, except for having the ones on each end of the hive open at the same time when it gets cold, the wind will blow straight through.
It may be okay in the summer but make sure the hive is situated so that you can keep an eye on both entrances so you can watch for robbing.
Thats why they suggested you cover the hole with a screen but will still get ventilation.
If you drill any holes make sure they are the same size as a cork or a dowel, something that you can close it up with.
Or if you want to be crafty you can put a little sliding door over it.

I like to have an entrance on the end and if a second one is needed I like the middle entrances.
Phil Chandler does the middle entrances only on his hives.
I have seen that alot of tbh beeks are using 3 holes on the side of the hive for their only entrances.
They cork them up as needed.

I have seen the queen and you can see eggs and brood in various stages.
The eggs are very tiny, smaller than a grain of rice but if you hold the comb in the right light, usually with the sun behind you, shining over your shoulder then you can see them.
I had to break off a small piece of comb that wasn't where it should be and after I brought it in the house I realized there were eggs in it.
My son took it to show and tell.

When you say two sheets on each edge, are you saying they built on each side of the slanted guide?
If thats the case they may connect it, just keep an eye on it.
Keep an eye on any comb that does not look right and cut it out as soon as you can so that they don't copy it.
If one is crazy they will built the ones next to it the same way so you need to cull out the weird comb.
Once you get straight comb they usually won't stray from that.

I have one hive that built out comb perfectly, then decided to add a smaller comb right up against it so that I had a small second layer of comb.

There were eggs in the big comb and I didn't want them to sandwich them in so I broke it off.
I went out a week later and they were doing the same exact thing on that same exact frame.

I removed it again but I have no idea why they want to do this so bad and its the only one that want to do it on.
If they do it again I may let it go to see what they are up to as bees seem to know what they need more than we do for the most part.
Normally I wouldn't, but all the other surrounding bars have perfect comb on them so there is no chance of them copying this bar to the others.

Hopefully they will straighten themselves out now that you are adding the rest of the bars, they usually know how to situate themselves.

 

[Mackay]

My neighbor in Idaho is starting bees this summer. She bought these cylinders that the 200 or so bees live in. These bees are just for pollinating as they don't make much honey, The best part is that they have no stinger and I like that idea.

In the winter you take the cylinders and put them in your fridge till the next season. They cost her $35.

Here is a site for beekeepers I came across.
http://wvbeekeeper.blogspot.com/

 

[the simple life]

The ones you are referring to are mason bees.
They only live for a few weeks in the spring, their cycle is very short but they are easy to keep.

I like honeybees and keep them because I like the honey
Actually, while I do like the honey I also like the interaction you get from keeping the bees in hives and observing how they live and work.
I think its amazing to see how they build that comb from scratch and then to have the queen lay the eggs and the workers care for the brood and maintain the hive.
Its really incredible to see how they all have certain jobs and function as a colony. Simply Amazing.

Other types of bees are good if you only want them for pollination and do not want the work or expense of keeping bees.
Mason bees do have a stinger but they usually do not use it.
Its used an egg guide but if they are really annoyed they will use it to sting.
They just won't attack you for going near the hive like some honeybees will.
Its most likely because they do not have anything to protect, as in someone wanting to steal their honey.

 

[Mackay]

Oh, Mason bees. Thanks. My DH cringes at the idea of keeping bees. So maybe this is a way to start.

I have a hard time imagining life without honey