Savingdogs-Saving the chickens

[savingdogs]

I may edit that off in a few after everyone checks it out....

Glenolam I think you should be able to access it because it isn't anyone in particular's page.

The Disney one really killed me....

 

[glenolam]

Ooooooooooo - don't edit it off until I've had a chance to read it!!!

 

[Dace]

Hey SD....

Thank you for all of the great ideas! I need to work o finding a nice mellow big dog for her to interact with....I wonder about taking our dog to the dog park in hopes of finding a friendly big dog, or do you think it would be too scary for Faith? I mean she would love to interact with nice dogs, but is seriously afraid of dogs in general.

We know a couple families with dogs, but they are out of control

She has learned a lot about body language and we do practice that when around the 'rowdies'. I remind her not to make eye contact, talk to or give any attention to the dog....it does help but she is terrified. The dog will sniff around a bit then leave her alone. After a few minutes things become normal and she plays with her friends and the dog ignores her, for the most part. The trouble is twofold....first not enough opportunity to practice and her natural instinct is to back away which encourages the dog to come towards her putting the dog in cotrol and trying to play...which reinforces her fear.

I try to discuss the training shows with her pointing out how different situations pertain to her, in her head she understands that she can control the situation, but in practice she has a very hard time controlling her fear and reaction to the dogs. We watched a great Dog Whisperer yesterday....a boy her age had an out of control huge husky, and Cesar showed him very quickly how to keep the dog from jumping....so she does understand that even a small person can be in control.

I will work on her training Teddy. She is comfortable with him, yet not completely trusting...if that makes sense.

I appreciate your advice

 

[Dace]

Oh my gosh......that facebook thread was HYSTERICAL!

 

[savingdogs]

Dog parks can be out of control, that is where I would NOT go to find a dog friend. I'm not really keen on the idea of dog parks although I go to them (I know, hypocrite) because of the lack of control everyone has over their dogs. I always have my exit strategy ready.

I would let friends know you are looking for this instead. I wish you were closer because my golden retriever would be perfect. In fact, most golden retrievers would be perfect. Big, hairy, overly friendly and kid friendly is kind of the hallmark of the breed, if you can find a typical one, that is the kind of dog it would be nice for her to get to know. Mine just expects kids to love him and pretty much wins them all over. Sometimes labs would be perfect especially older ones. And those two breeds are common. But a nice old mutt would be good too, just anything big.

I teach kids to stand with their arms crossed and look up and put their nose in the air like they are "stuck up" I tell them, if they want the dog to back off and it is invading her space. Dogs understand that concept very well because they use that with one another. They consider the space between their front paws "theirs" so teach her to be careful when dogs have toys and such in that spot, and they do not allow "lesser beings" to invade that space. They will not necessarily think she is a "higher" being than themselves unless she shows them this. I tell kids to "make themselves big" and remark when dogs put their hair up that they are "making themselves big" and tell them that to dogs, big means tough. But mention not to take things away from dogs unless they can give them something better, at least for now.

Another point for kids to master is how dogs learn. They learn by being told something over and over and over and having something good happen at the same time. Or being told (or shown) something over and over and have something bad happen, if it is a behavior you don't want. This makes it easy for kids to understand, very simple. But it gives you the chance to bring up what to when the "something bad" needs to happen. Children should always be taught not to hit dogs, as that is a sure way to have the dog bite them. They are better off using a scolding tone or grabbing the collar (if they are tall enough) and not swinging arms around if there is something really "bad" going on. I taught my kids that if they thought the dog needed to be punished, it was time to call ME. But kids can do the positive reinforcement part all the time. And a "punishment" to a dog might be just you withholding your attention. I tell kids...what they hate is to be ignored. If dogs are mouthy, for instance, I tell them to stop petting them or looking at them until they stop. That is a "punishment" to a puppy. In reality I do punish dogs, but I give them a shake on the scruff and would rather that be left to an adult.

Once she is doing better with some really nice dogs you could move towards younger bouncy bigger dogs. As far as where to find them, you might see if there is a local 4H club with some dog people who might help you out. Most people LOVE to share their dog with people and have others enjoy their dog so don't be afraid to ask. Or your vet might know someone with a trained therapy dog or a Canine Good Citizen. People speically train their dogs to be good with people who need company, they might find this to be something worthwhile to have their dog do. I would.

A real easy trick for her to teach your sheltie would be speak. Tell her to say the word "speak" every time the dog barks. After she has done that for awhile, have her hold up a small treat and say speak and if the dog does, get SUPER excited and give the treat immediately. Usually once that happens once they get it. If they are around another speaking dog they get it too. Shake is also really easy for them to learn especially if they tend to paw for attention. Kids really love to show off dogs doing tricks. Even playing dead is actually really easy to teach dogs, I could describe that one, but speak and sit and shake are better starter ones. Shelties are often the kind of dog that likes to do fun little tricks with kids. I have a collie that does tricks very well, my sons have really enjoyed that.
Then you can tell her she is "good" with dogs and a natural and all that mommy stuff we say to boost them up. Kids and dogs learn the same way so they work well together, small steps, short sessions, and when she gets a successful moment, tell her to "stop on a good note."

Hope that helps! That is what I tend to say to kids when they are adopting a young dog from us or I'm worried they may be a little inexperienced. And if the dog has a particular issue, I tell that child how to deal with that issue, not learning tricks. But it sounds like you have a nice little dog Dace for her to get comfortable around, you might just let that dog do the convincing for you. Not everyone is a big dog person. Having a great relationship with one great dog is better than many with various results.

 

[Dace]

SD thank you for all the great info! I appreciate your taking the time to give me so much good advice.

I am going to call my vet and see if he knows of any big old friendly dogs that I could expose her to, I never would have thought of that!

Yesterday she went to a friend's house, who has a very enthusiastic English bulldog. She is usually afraid of him but she did well and worked on just sticking her nose up and ignoring him until he lost interest. By the end of her visit she pet him good bye and gave him a kiss on his back. Also while they were playing the mom was visiting with a neighbor who was walking her two little dogs and the girls played with them....the mom is my friend and knows about Faiths fear of dogs. So a very good dogggy day!

It is going to be a challenge to find good dogs to expose her to, so I will keep working on it, thanks again!

Also I am going to have her work with Teddy, she has been pushing to 'have the clicker' so I guess it is time!

 

[savingdogs]

Sounds like the bulldog is just the thing, Dace!

I think they are so funny! I love them. Perhaps the tough exterior and adorableness of that particular dog will be helpful. Some really do "throw their weight around" so it sounds like your friends dog is a nice one. I'd go with that for now.....

 

[Dace]

When I say enthusiastic what I really mean is nearly out of control! but he is a good dog in that he is sweet and friendly.....just a bit over enthusiastic!

The interesting thing is that my friend mentioned that they want to do some obedience training with him.....a little bell went off in my head and I think Faith and I may just volunteer to go help her with a few basics, like teaching him not to charge the door when it is opened! It would be good for Faith to participate, even if it is only one little session.....I think for her to see how being assertive and taking a position of authority can change a dogs behavior, in real life not on tv, would be very impactful.

Anyhow, it is really nice of you to share so much info I know that her fear will always be there, I just want her to understand that she can control her fears and focus on 'turning on' her confidence around dogs, even if the fear is there and the confidence is fake! If that makes sense!

 

[savingdogs]

Ah, dangit! Bandit has gone and killed the little Red Hen. So much for her training. We had her out in the dog yard with all the dogs and were not really watching.

The little red hen has been refusing to stay in the chicken pen but she usually just thought that she was a GOAT so I didn't think she would fly into the dog yard. Apparently she did because she is missing and the dogs were "playing" with a RIR chicken carcass. I'm horrified because it is terrible training for Jake, who was out there playing with her. He isn't going where chickens live but still......

And that was our favorite chicken......and her carcass is ruined, we cannot even eat her. I'm bummed about it but even more MAD at myself. I knew I should have clipped her wings and had every chance and I just was lazy and didn't want to go look for the scissors in the house.
I never would have been able to eat the little Red Hen anyways. She was with the first batch of chicks we bought and has always been the only chicken that really liked to be petted and fussed over.

I guess I have to go back to tethering Bandit out front for her potty breaks. I am so mad at her right now I can't see straight.

 

[Farmfresh]

Sorry to hear about Little Red hen.

I was going to ask you the other day if you tried to teach the foster dogs about your chickens and other animals. When we had to re-home our German Shepherd Sirius it really made a difference in finding him a new home because he had been exposed to lots of different farm animals.