Good Article on Vaccinations

[reinbeau]

The Patriot act doesn't bother me (and yes, I am well aware of the ramifications of it). I'm not a terrorist, nor will I ever be under that suspicion. I am more concerned with losing my right to make decisions about myself, my children, raising them as I see fit, not as some government agency ostensibly set up to 'help' decides I should raise them. That includes vaccinating them appropriately, not according to a schedule that pays little attention to their actual needs and more attention to some bottom line somewhere.

 

[Beekissed]

I'm not a political type person and I don't have strong convictions, like HiDelight, that our government is still working for the people. I don't follow all the political debates, nor do I(gasp!) even vote.

Most of you would say that this would render my opinion on these issues moot, as I have heard that refrain many times...."If you don't vote, you can't complain!" Sure I can! But I usually do not.

When it comes to these types of issues....like our individual freedoms...its always a hot button. Even for me. The nonvoter. I don't vote because I don't really have faith in our system.....haven't for a long time. Never did, really.

Nor am I naive enough to believe that, if we just want it bad enough and yell loud enough, it can change. It is still steamrollering right on over the little folks, just like it always has.....with the screaming and protesting being drowned out by the huge crunch of the wheel.

No, I'm not normally a pessimist...anyone who has followed my journal would say that I'm pretty upbeat and cheerful about most things.

Nor am I really into wasting effort on lost causes. Our political machine is really and truly a lost cause. Has been for many, many moons.

I guess what I'm trying to say is this: It seems to me, as an outside observer of the political enthusiasts, there is always someone who says, "If you aren't satisfied, it is probably because you aren't working to change things and just whining about them." Its really all they CAN say in the face of the fact that the government in all its myriad facets, does not even resemble the one with which we started.

They can say it all they want and they may even believe that they are affecting change in small but significant ways. But this doesn't negate the fact that our individual freedoms are disappearing at an alarming rate, no matter how many folks kick and scream and protest. Its happening anyway. It will continue to happen anyway.

Its supposed to happen, according to my belief system.

By saying, "At least I'M trying, instead of just complaining", it seems they are not at fault for the state of our country.

We all are. Americans, collectively, have been lazy, indifferent, tolerant of greed and avarice and have grown soft in our values. Not just us nonvoters and people who have realized its all too big to fight now. Even all you activists...yes, you. At fault also. If we hadn't let it become this big, this bad, this monstrous, we wouldn't have to scream and shout to try to control it.

To argue about when and where it all went wrong or why it does what it does is really futile. We are here and it is what it is. No it doesn't feel good, but we are reaping what our fathers sowed. Nothing will stop that harvest. You only have to look at the past to see our future.

Its like having a bratty kid. We created it but we still feel compelled to complain when they do us dirty. Its the nature of us, the nature of the world, the nature of where we live.

For all you folks arrogant enough, or is it naive enough?, to believe you can change it...I say, go for it!

For all of you who really can't stand what your child has become....its okay to complain about it and question its motives. After all, you know it well and can expect it to behave just as it has in the past.

For all of us on the sidelines who really just want to ride out the mayhem without expecting change...I say, lets do the best we can in the face of bad times. Find a way through or around. If you cannot, stand your ground.

Either way, we are in the same boat, so we might as well try to get along and get over it.

 

[hollybird]

i would like to put in my vote against vaccines at their current age guide. my son was given the mmr at 16 mnths and had an immediate reaction becoming very sick and having a high fever. can i prove his autism was caused by the mmr? no. i know it's easy to debate numbers and causes but it is different when it's your bright child that stops talking. between vaccines, vitamins and over taxed immune systems, etc. there are a lot of theories. the truth will be hidden longer than necessary because of the liability associated with the cause.

 

[Mackay]

The Patriot act doesn't bother me (and yes, I am well aware of the ramifications of it). I'm not a terrorist, nor will I ever be under that suspicion. I am more concerned with losing my right to make decisions about myself, my children, raising them as I see fit, not as some government agency ostensibly set up to 'help' decides I should raise them. That includes vaccinating them appropriately, not according to a schedule that pays little attention to their actual needs and more attention to some bottom line somewhere.

Then how can you possibly say that the patriot act does not bother you!
It intends to take away your rights, and those of your children.

http://www.aclu.org/safefree/resources/17343res20031114.html

and especially this one. Read the fourth paragraph down, by Dr Laibow, regarding forced vaccinations

http://www.disinfo.com/content/story.php?title=Help-Stop-Forced-Vaccination-Children

 

[Mackay]

For all you folks arrogant enough, or is it naive enough?, to believe you can change it...I say, go for it!
.

I have great hope that through education and awakening that I can save my sorry ass and those of my children.

You sound like the ultimate pessimist to me.

I believe that I am responsible for creating my reality and I will always endeavor to act in ways that will promote my highest good and for those of the people who surround me.

I am not one to sit back and get steamrolled by not opening my mind and my eyes to the realities that are out there.

If you don't take care of yourself and your community who will.

 

[reinbeau]

The Patriot act doesn't bother me (and yes, I am well aware of the ramifications of it). I'm not a terrorist, nor will I ever be under that suspicion. I am more concerned with losing my right to make decisions about myself, my children, raising them as I see fit, not as some government agency ostensibly set up to 'help' decides I should raise them. That includes vaccinating them appropriately, not according to a schedule that pays little attention to their actual needs and more attention to some bottom line somewhere.

Then how can you possibly say that the patriot act does not bother you!

I can say it because it doesn't. We'll have to agree to disagree on it. Plus as far as I'm concerned it's more Bush hatred fear mongering, and I truly don't want to hear it anymore. He isn't the president. Move on. Obama has his own evil tricks up his sleeve, he's the one in power, and he is the one we need to watch right now.

And before this goes any further, let me say categorically, I am no Bush lover. I'm just not a Bush hater. The Bush Hatred is what got us Obama. I am tired of it.

Now, back to vaccinations.

 

[Mackay]

More on Vaccinations:

From Dr Laibow:

"Like mental health drugging, vaccination is often forced upon children despite the clear dangers of inoculation (especially early infant inoculation and multiple vaccinations) and the low scientific validity of the procedure. The Patriot Act and other federal legislation add to the compulsory vaccine menace by allowing compulsory universal vaccination with undisclosed, unclassified and untested substances in the event of various ill-defined threats or supposed threats to public well being. Refusal will, according to the Patriot and BioShield I and II Acts, result in indefinite incarceration or "quarantine". "

 

[Beekissed]

For all you folks arrogant enough, or is it naive enough?, to believe you can change it...I say, go for it!
.

I have great hope that through education and awakening that I can save my sorry ass and those of my children.

You sound like the ultimate pessimist to me.
I believe that I am responsible for creating my reality and I will always endeavor to act in ways that will promote my highest good and for those of the people who surround me.

I am not one to sit back and get steamrolled by not opening my mind and my eyes to the realities that are out there.

If you don't take care of yourself and your community who will.

I prefer the term, "realist". Being pessimistic about one thing, of which many, many are pessimistic can be called realism. Being optimistic about something that no one has been able to change in the past and that is growing worse and worse, can be called naivete.

Its all in one's perspective, really.

Now, if I were overall a pessimistic person and generally took a dim view of most subjects discussed, then one could say I was a true pessimist.

Pessimismn. 1. the tendency to see only what is gloomy or to anticipate the worst.

Ultimate1. n. unequaled or unsurpassed.

By your description, Mackay, I am unequaled, or unsurpassed, on this Earth in the tendency to see only what is gloomy or to anticipate the worst.

If you truly believe this, without having met me, and judging me from a single thread on a forum....then I would have to stand by my statement about naivete.

Here's another word to remember:

Exaggerate: 1. to magnify beyond the limits of truth; overstate or overemphasize.

If you don't take care of yourself and your community who will.

Now, I've never been accused of this little item. Especially not in my community or, especially, by my family. In other words, those who truly know me, know that I take care of my world and the small world around me very well.

Now, it seems this is a tender subject for you, Mackay, and that is all well and good. But it seems you are lashing out at complete strangers in a hurtful manner to make a point. It makes me wonder why you feel the need to do that? If you misunderstood my posts, I can maybe paraphrase it for you......

I feel its futile to argue these issues when we are just gonna be able to argue them for a long time to come. Why waste the time when we can just take care of our own the best we can and save our breath by not arguing?

But then, if you take umbrage over my expressing an opinion that did not single you out, in particular, and make it a personal issue....I can only guess you just like to argue!

Realism: n. 1. to see things as they really are.

 

[me&thegals]

The fact remains that the rate of autism rose sharply after they increased the required vaccines. That is not merely coincedence. The fact also remains that the preservative used contains mercury, which is a known toxin. Given to infants repeatedly? Common sense tells one that there is a link.

And that was the ONLY thing that changed during that time? I don't know either way, but this seems to be straining logic a bit. Mercury is out now, and has the rate of autism dropped?

Maybe I could just make an observation and then duck and run. This thread has gotten very heated very quickly and actually a little nasty. It seems like a very typical response for a subject that has great fear attached to it, a sense of helplessness and a lack of understanding.

We don't KNOW for sure what causes autism, we are AFRAID of autism and the diseases the vaccines prevent and we feel HELPLESS to change the system very quickly.

As for me and mine, I vaccinated. I was not a very careful health consumer at that point in my life. If I had it to do all over again, my son would NOT have been vaccinated for hep B the day he was born. I would have chosen only those that cause death, not the more minor respiratory diseases or chickenpox. I would have spaced out those I chose to have given to my children and not gone for 4 shots at a time. My daughter will not be vaccinated for HPV until she is old enough to choose it for herself. Thankfully my kids never had reactions to vaccines and have been wonderfully healthy kids.

That said, I have read too many books about abject poverty in other parts of the world to not see the direct link between lack of immunizations and incredibly high death and disease rates (especially Africa). Vaccinations can absolutely change the face of the globe.

I think we all get stuck in this error in logic that says it has to be all good or all bad. Can't vaccines be incredibly useful sometimes, some places and in some methods? And, yes, they can also be abused by pharmaceuticals and government agencies. So, it's our job to find our own ground somewhere in there.

 

[Mackay]

I give up.