I watched the documentary "Fat Head" ....

[ZohBug]

Hmmm... just a few observations, and fwiw, I did my undergrad and grad in physical and medical anthropology and then went on to pick up a diploma in clinical massage therapy and have also been certified as a personal trainer and group fitness instructor.

Thin does not equal healthy and one does not have to exercise to be thin. There are many factors which determine body type. There are many "overweight" people who are healthier than their "thin" counterparts. Just because one is overweight doesn't mean that one does not exercise regularly and won't outlive the thin person who is perceived to be healthy because of the numbers on the scale. Exercising doesn't make one thin and it doesn't necessarily make one healthy. Can it help? Sure. But it's certainly not the magical answer. More and more studies are coming out that show that an appropriate diet is more protective and promotes longevity moreso than exercise. If someone came to me today and said they could only do one or the other, I'd tell them to eat well first. And usually, once people realize better health and mental clarity from eating well, then they want to move more as a natural consequence. Just my own $0.02.

 

[Wifezilla]

I gave that example as a start. Here is another one you are going to love because it compares 2 societies of about the same size in the same region at different time periods. One society was hunter/gatherer and the other was agricultural based. It factors out the royalty vs peasant issue.

http://www.proteinpower.com/drmike/...lth-in-agriculturalists-and-hunter-gatherers/

The tie between dental disease and heart disease is well known. Mummies are not the only clues to the health (or lack there-of) of a culture.
http://www.uic.edu/classes/osci/osci590/11_1Epidemiology.htm

If you join scribd, you can download the work of Weston Price who compared cultures living on "modern" diets vs cultures living on traditional foods...much of it animal based.
http://www.scribd.com/doc/5988464/Weston-Price-Nutrition-and-Physical-Degeneration?autodown=pdf

 

[meriruka]

I' not saying that you can ignore your diet and exercising will solve everything. Nor am I saying that everyone who is not thin is unhealthy. What I'm saying is that comparing those two particular cultures is apples & oranges. It would be more convincing if they had compared cultures that lived in the same period of time, with similar life spans, similar levels of housing/lifestyle and levels of exercise, but the two different diets. Then the effects of diet could be seen more clearly.

Edited to say, WZ you type faster than I do! I submitted the above response & just now see yours. I'm off to read the links you provided. Thanks.

 

[ZohBug]

I' not saying that you can ignore your diet and exercising will solve everything. Nor am I saying that everyone who is not thin is unhealthy. What I'm saying is that comparing those two particular cultures is apples & oranges. It would be more convincing if they had compared cultures that lived in the same period of time, with similar life spans, similar levels of housing/lifestyle and levels of exercise, but the two different diets. Then the effects of diet could be seen more clearly.

But we already know that doesn't work. Studies have shown that contemporary people of different racial and ethnic groups have different dietary needs, different responses to medications, different manifestations of illnesses, etc. We also know that there are variations based on gender and age. That's why any study will necessarily be imperfect.

 

[Wifezilla]

you type faster than I do!

I cheated. I already have my coffee

 

[meriruka]

I' not saying that you can ignore your diet and exercising will solve everything. Nor am I saying that everyone who is not thin is unhealthy. What I'm saying is that comparing those two particular cultures is apples & oranges. It would be more convincing if they had compared cultures that lived in the same period of time, with similar life spans, similar levels of housing/lifestyle and levels of exercise, but the two different diets. Then the effects of diet could be seen more clearly.

But we already know that doesn't work. Studies have shown that contemporary people of different racial and ethnic groups have different dietary needs, different responses to medications, different manifestations of illnesses, etc. We also know that there are variations based on gender and age. That's why any study will necessarily be imperfect.

So you are saying that comparison studies are only meaningful
if done within a specific ethnic/racial group?

 

[ZohBug]

So you are saying that comparison studies are only meaningful if done within a specific ethnic/racial group?

What I'm saying is that when you read a particular study, you have be clear on what type of question you're asking when interpreting the results. They do perform studies within particular racial/ethnic groups based on the particular question. You can do a Medline search for a particular hypertension medication and see how it fared in black males as compared to white males in a particular age group and find out what the results were. The information may even be summarized on the packaging insert. So those specific, targeted studies are done. But when you're targeting something broader and cross-cultural, one should keep in mind that it is an incomplete and imperfect study because that is the nature of the beast. That doesn't make them invalid or not "meaningful" but they should be interpreted in that context and one should be prepared to ask those questions and not consider it to have the definitive answers.

 

[Wifezilla]

One of my favorite studies is about the Tokelau natives. Tokelau is an atoll near New Zealand. Their diet was comprised of about 70% coconut, fish and some breadfruit. While many Pacific Island cultures grew starchy vegetables and ate high levels of carbohydrates in the form of taro, yams, breadfruit, etc....according to reports on the Tokelau, they did not have cultivation and, though they ate breadfruit, they got most of their nourishment from coconut and fish.

The New Zealand gvmt became concerned about overpopulation and allowed atoll residents to move to the main land. They shortly afterward developed obesity, type 2 diabetes and other "diseases of civilization". Those that stayed on the island were also now getting regular shipments of white flour, sugar, and tobacco. They also started getting sick and diseases they didn't even had words for appeared in the population. Then the boat that supplied the atoll broke down for a long time (months I think??). Suddenly people started losing weight. The diabetics didn't need to go to the clinic anymore. People with heart disease improved. All this was due to not having access to white flour and sugar and a return to their high fat native diet.

Gary Taubes writes about this is his book "Good Calories Bad Calories" if you want to look it up yourself.

Another great study was done a couple of years ago by Dr. Jay Wortman. He returned a village of First Peoples in Canada to a modern approximation of their native diet. Obesity, heart disease, type 2 diabetes, etc... all went WAY down. http://www.drjaywortman.com/blog/wordpress/about/

 

[Dace]

Abi...

Insulin also effects how all the other hormones react (all hormones do this. If you have too much adrenaline or serotonin or testosterone it'll mess things up too) and can throw the entire endocrine system out of whack. It increases cortisol which makes your fight/flight get all uppity. So you get more stressed and then serotonin gets involved and you crave more carbs and therefore make more insulin. It is a really dangerous cycle.

If you read studies on people with adrenaline always pumping (ptsd, anxiety disorders) you see a lot of the same issues. Fight/flight stays really active, and all the other hormones get ot of whack. The big deal with insulin is that it is the only hormone that effects fat storage and so there are a lot of extra health issues, such as the malnourishment of weight gain and heart issues and strokes.

So people who eat a lot of carbs not only inflame their intestines so they absorb less ANYWAY, they also keep their insulin pumping and therefore have all the side effects of that. Plus insulin changes the way your body uses vitamins. So you absorb fewer and use them wrong, creating more malnutrition so your body tries to store more fat to help out...

That was really informative! Thank you

 

[Wifezilla]

And if any of you are up for another documentary....
http://www.cbc.ca/thelens/bigfatdiet/index.html
http://www.mybigfatdiet.net/buydvd.html