Obama finally called them out

[me&thegals]

Reinbeau, can I just ask what your point actually is? Yes, people have always needed clean air, water, decent food, etc. Okay. I guess I don't understand where you are trying to go with that.

 

[enjoy the ride]

I think it clear what reinbeau is saying- that no one should expect it is a right to have someone pay for what you actually need or what you think you need. The constitution is a document about the limits of government - government can't promote a religion, it does not say that any one is obligated to have their taxes go to support your religion- just the opposite. It says the government can not discriminate according to race- it does not say that a certian per cent of the Congress must be that race. It says that there should be the right assembly- not that the government pays for the Odd Fellow hall.
Can you give an example of anything the Consitution actually is required as a right to give someone except an equal chance? All the rest is intrepretation that changes with the Supreme Court's attitudes. And that is widening all the time. Maybe the right to life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness will come to mean that anything that increases the chance of life will be a right but it was originally meant to mean that the government couldn't deprive a person of these and nothing more.

The cry of "A Right" is used very freely by many.

 

[Big Daddy]

Human health and the need for care has not changed in 200+ years. Not even in 300+.

No, think about it -- human health expectations, and what health care consists of and how it's provided, have changed MASSIVELY in the last 200 (really, 100) years.

Now where in my statement did I say anything at all about expectations? Nowhere. Do not insert words that I didn't say and didn't mean. I don't care what people expect. People expect quite a lot lately from society, but aren't as willing to put in the hard work they themselves should put in. No, Pat, human needs haven't changed one iota.

Perhaps human needs haven't changed. Fortunately technology has. Unfortunately technology is expensive. I read on another thread about some guy back around the SF earthquake got kicked by a horse. He died later in life from a bone disease related to that incident. Like Pat said. If you were well to do you got whatever the latest technology there was. If not you died. It looks as though some people feel it should still be that way. Fortunately we are in a place where some compassion will be shown. That is what the rush is all about. In 2010 things may change and a much less compassionate and inclusive bunch may be in Congress. Got to get what you can while you can.

 

[Big Daddy]

People can always EXPECT to have someone else provide services for free....but it doesn't change the fact that it is stealing if the person you are getting the services from isn't voluntarily providing it.

Is slavery in the as yet to be created bill? I might have missed that part.

 

[reinbeau]

Taking from one person's earnings to fund another's 'rights' is a form of slavery so yes, it is written into the bill.

Enjoy the ride, thank you for getting it - but I knew you did. It's the rest that don't.

 

[me&thegals]

Ok, ETR, that helps. I would argue that "life, liberty and pursuit of happiness" are inextricably tied into health. As the old saying goes, "If you don't have health, you don't have anything."

 

[patandchickens]

Taking from one person's earnings to fund another's 'rights' is a form of slavery so yes, it is written into the bill.

Fine, then we've all been slaves ALL OUR LIVES since taking from one person's earnings to fund another's 'rights' is deeply interwoven into the structure of gov't spending and taxing and has been going on since the very beginning.

For heaven's sake, what about *Medicare/Medicaid* -- they are ALREADY tax-funded health care for them as need help (just not as comprehensive as what's being proposed), , paid for mainly by those who are not eligible to use the services in fact.

I can understand objecting, for any of various reasons, to current plans ont he table or to the whole idea of expanding gov't-supported public health care in general... but for heaven's sake, it is not some utterly new revolutionary way of taxing or spending.

Pat

 

[reinbeau]

You know, Pat, some people have reached the tipping point. Enough is enough. You may have an unending supply of money to keep giving to your government, but most of us don't. It's just that simple, and no amount of condescending sarcasm is going to change the way we feel.

 

[Wifezilla]

You may have an unending supply of money to keep giving to your government, but most of us don't. It's just that simple, and no amount of condescending sarcasm is going to change the way we feel.

We are evil for noticing the extra hands in our pockets for some strange reason.

 

[farmerlor]

I just find it odd the the "tipping point" comes under this president who is only trying to help our own people who need help so desperately. Odd that the "tipping point" wasn't during the last administration when we were sending billions and billions to fight a war that was unnecessary and made many of that president's friends quite rich.
We've all heard the stories about people who have to get divorced to be able to get medical coverage. People who lose their homes and go bankrupt over medical costs and yet THIS is the thing that is going to cause a revolution in this country? I just don't get it.