This will scare you.

[rebecca100]

We are stocking up right now on what we can. I just bought gas at the highest price I have ever seen which was $3.60. I know that doesn't sound too high to some people, but around here it is unbelieveable. We are gathering seeds and getting ready to move to our more sustainable 10 acres in the middle of nowhere.

 

[Dunkopf]

I remember poor Jimmy Carter and just put on another sweater thing, odd and even gas days. I thought then (optimistic me) that people would change, but no. Huge gas guzzlers came back within 2 years.

I have the news on in the background this morning as I am writing this. The winner of some survey for top "family" car is the Chevy Suburban. Sigh.

Yep he actually was trying to develop an energy plan. Put solar panels on the White House. First thing Ronny did was have them torn down and tell everyone to use as much oil as they could. Too bad Carter screwed up the Iran hostage situation so badly and that he was challenged in the Primaries. We would have missed out on Ronny and things would have probably been a little better now, at least on the energy side. Of course every time a Republican gets in office they roll back mileage requirements and stop any funding for alternative energy research and development. I'm afraid we are always going to be behind the rest of the world on energy use and plain old common sense. Just too short sighted and those that could do something about it are too greedy.

 

[Dunkopf]

It was all bound to happen sooner or later. People will only live under dictatorships for so long before they rebel. I think the food prices are what has driven those people to do something about it.

Obama is just keeping his nose out of it. After all our nation is supposed to be evangelical about Democracy. Not just talk about it and help suppress it as we have done in the Mideast for around 40 years or so.

Our leaders have known the score for many years. They have done nothing about it with minor exceptions. The chickens are coming home to roost. Doesn't matter who's in the WH. It will all come out the same.

Can a couple drafts pull a 6000 pound Suburban around? Maybe yank the engine and transmission.

 

[Wifezilla]

ep he actually was trying to develop an energy plan. Put solar panels on the White House. First thing Ronny did was have them torn down and tell everyone to use as much oil as they could. Too bad Carter screwed up the Iran hostage situation so badly and that he was challenged in the Primaries. We would have missed out on Ronny and things would have probably been a little better now, at least on the energy side. Of course every time a Republican gets in office they roll back mileage requirements and stop any funding for alternative energy research and development. I'm afraid we are always going to be behind the rest of the world on energy use and plain old common sense. Just too short sighted and those that could do something about it are too greedy.

I am not sure if you remember me mentioning this or not, but during the Reagan years, I was in a solar engineering program. Guess what? It was not economically feasible back then and in a lot of cases it still isn't now (unless you are talking passive solar as part of initial new construction). There have been some technological advances, but the math STILL doesn't work.

If alternative energy is workable, it does not NEED federal funding. When is the last time federal funding created anything other than more paperwork? Hubby and I have been tracking this field for decades. Him from the perspective of a former stock broker and me from the stand point of a former engineering student. Companies form around a story. They use the story to generate buzz and get some PR. Then they use the story to grab federal (as in MY and YOUR) money. The stories sound great, but they don't pan out. The companies fizzle out and fade away.

Does the name EVERGREEN SOLAR ring a bell?
http://www.mlive.com/midland/index....cture_up_to_365_million_of_debt_extended.html

There are ways individuals can save energy, but it is not by using these big gvnmt green projects. There is a demand for small, scalable, consumer level renewable energy. But you aren't going to get that with a gvnmt program.

 

[MsPony]

I really wish Obama would put a cap on gas prices. $4.13 at the cheap places here, I'm majorly depressed.

 

[bornthrifty]

ep he actually was trying to develop an energy plan. Put solar panels on the White House. First thing Ronny did was have them torn down and tell everyone to use as much oil as they could. Too bad Carter screwed up the Iran hostage situation so badly and that he was challenged in the Primaries. We would have missed out on Ronny and things would have probably been a little better now, at least on the energy side. Of course every time a Republican gets in office they roll back mileage requirements and stop any funding for alternative energy research and development. I'm afraid we are always going to be behind the rest of the world on energy use and plain old common sense. Just too short sighted and those that could do something about it are too greedy.

I am not sure if you remember me mentioning this or not, but during the Reagan years, I was in a solar engineering program. Guess what? It was not economically feasible back then and in a lot of cases it still isn't now (unless you are talking passive solar as part of initial new construction). There have been some technological advances, but the math STILL doesn't work.

If alternative energy is workable, it does not NEED federal funding. When is the last time federal funding created anything other than more paperwork? Hubby and I have been tracking this field for decades. Him from the perspective of a former stock broker and me from the stand point of a former engineering student. Companies form around a story. They use the story to generate buzz and get some PR. Then they use the story to grab federal (as in MY and YOUR) money. The stories sound great, but they don't pan out. The companies fizzle out and fade away.

Does the name EVERGREEN SOLAR ring a bell?
http://www.mlive.com/midland/index....cture_up_to_365_million_of_debt_extended.html

There are ways individuals can save energy, but it is not by using these big gvnmt green projects. There is a demand for small, scalable, consumer level renewable energy. But you aren't going to get that with a gvnmt program.

thanks for sharing this I have heard it before, but nice to be reminded,
wifezilla, wondering if since you have experience with solar if you have any wisdom to share on endergy in general, I have heard from insider types of the industry that clean coal is good, and that nuclear is actually where we need to go, (like france I guess) as it doesn't have very much waste, (because I guess they now can reuse the waste and even turn that into energy...) and that it makes enough electricity for our future electricity demand...

would you agree on any of that? or can you offer up from your own experience where we can find enough energy to meet the demands of now and growing demand...

I ask under the assumption that once you have worked in a certain feild you sort of notice what is going on in general...what might actually be viable...because like you pointed out, if it really works it doesn't have to be subsidized...
thanks

 

[me&thegals]

Lets face it, big oil shortages and huge price increase are coming. We let politics and big oil do this to us.We had our chance in the 70's to learn a good lesson from the Carter era Arab oil embargo.That was the time to go full steam ahead with solar/wind energy.Now were really behind the eight ball.

People in general, & maybe Americans in particular, are very short-sighted. As soon as the crisis appears to be over, we go back to our old ways. Many of us on this forum are old enough to remember the oil embargo days (& what was gas then - $.70/gal??), the gas lines, only being able to fill up on odd/even days, etc. & you have to wonder, how'd we let it get to this?? Did all of that teach us NOTHING?

Totally agree. My husband says we should replace our 15-yo car now before gas shoots up and people are looking for used fuel-economic vehicles (which is what I will be looking for). I think, "Huh? Did people seriously already forget from the last time?" I know it's a pretty big priority for me, but I'm still surprised at how Duh our country is about oil.

 

[me&thegals]

ep he actually was trying to develop an energy plan. Put solar panels on the White House. First thing Ronny did was have them torn down and tell everyone to use as much oil as they could. Too bad Carter screwed up the Iran hostage situation so badly and that he was challenged in the Primaries. We would have missed out on Ronny and things would have probably been a little better now, at least on the energy side. Of course every time a Republican gets in office they roll back mileage requirements and stop any funding for alternative energy research and development. I'm afraid we are always going to be behind the rest of the world on energy use and plain old common sense. Just too short sighted and those that could do something about it are too greedy.

I am not sure if you remember me mentioning this or not, but during the Reagan years, I was in a solar engineering program. Guess what? It was not economically feasible back then and in a lot of cases it still isn't now (unless you are talking passive solar as part of initial new construction). There have been some technological advances, but the math STILL doesn't work.

If alternative energy is workable, it does not NEED federal funding. When is the last time federal funding created anything other than more paperwork? Hubby and I have been tracking this field for decades. Him from the perspective of a former stock broker and me from the stand point of a former engineering student. Companies form around a story. They use the story to generate buzz and get some PR. Then they use the story to grab federal (as in MY and YOUR) money. The stories sound great, but they don't pan out. The companies fizzle out and fade away.

Does the name EVERGREEN SOLAR ring a bell?
http://www.mlive.com/midland/index....cture_up_to_365_million_of_debt_extended.html

There are ways individuals can save energy, but it is not by using these big gvnmt green projects. There is a demand for small, scalable, consumer level renewable energy. But you aren't going to get that with a gvnmt program.

Yeah, well coal and nuclear are also subsidized.

 

[Wifezilla]

If I were made Queen of America tomorrow (scary thought eh? LOL) I would be opening nuclear plants like mad ala France . We already have a place to store the waste. (Yucca Flats)

The funny thing I when I first start taking solar classes I was VERY anti-nuke. I quickly changed my mind. Funny with math can do

The main thing the gvnmt can do is allow individual homeowners to be more energy diverse. If you were to build a home tomorrow using passive solar with a wood stove back up, and PVC panels on the roof off grid, you could not get a home loan. Even with a big down payment, they will not let you NOT be on the grid.

"replacing efficient energy with inefficient sources will no more advance the economy than replacing trucks with horses."
http://www.theepochtimes.com/n2/content/view/21780/

 

[Boogity]

. . . Doesn't matter who's in the WH. It will all come out the same . . .

OMG!!! It may be this kind of thinking that has us in today's predicament.