vaccinations---pros and cons

[xpc]

I think you friend is overreacting but is probably just doing so as a defense for her own children and knows not what she does. Of course you can always use this as an opportunity to prune her from your list as the shorter the better.

I tend to stay out of any vaccination topics as it is looked upon by some in an ungodly religious fervor, dooming the filthy human race to the Four Horsemen of the Apocalypse. The black plague comes December the 21st twenty twelve so this matter is really moot.

 

[~gd]

I am in a dilemma. My children were on a regular vaccination schedule until my daughter was 15 months old and my son was 3. They have not received any required immunizations since the doses from those ages.

My BF has told me that if I do not continue to get them vaccinated that I cannot be invited to her house whenever there are infants because of the health risk (nevermind that we have been there for the last 2 yrs without). Anyway, my question is this:

Should I allow my children to get the vaccinations they need to catch up to the recommended schedule or are they okay with the vaccines they have received so far?

In the intrest of full disclosure, I worked in the manufacture of vaccines for infants and children (humans) for the last 25 years before retiring ~a year ago. We pretty much wiped out 2 nasty diseases(in the USA) and greatly reduced the incidence of several others. Even with that background there are a few vaccines that I would skip or wait until the child is older. The hepatitis shot is one that I would delay. that type of hepatitis is a STD (sexually transmitted disease) and they do like to catch kids young because it is very hard to get them in the office when they are older. But no body really knows how long immunity lasts because the vaccine hasn't been around that long! Works great on adults and teens but that was determined by testing on adults first and then teens the children should not be old enough yet to know if it lasts that long. Some of the new vaccines are not as long lasting as the ones they replaced. Outbreaks of measles in college? never happened with the old vaccines, the new ones require a booster for protection. for those concerned about the Mercury that used be used, they now have low or no mercury versions available, ask and be prepared to pay a little more for them because they have shorter shelf lives and cost more to package than the old multiple dose packs. As for the docs that push the vaccines they are taking a risk to let a child go unvaccinated it is actually considered considered to be signs of a faulty practice of medicine. It is cheaper to vaccinate than it is to treat any of the diseases. My last project was to expand the the pnumo vaccine from 7 to 13 subtypes making it the most expensive vaccine ever but the new added subtypes are very rare in the USA so the benefits will be for Europe, Asia, and Africa where the governments and people can't afford them so good old Bill Gates will be paying for them if they get them at all. Same with the non injected polio vaccine that wiped out Polio in the new world. Not good enough for the rest of the world they insist on the injectable version that takes trained people to do the injection. The old one just needed to be placed on a sugar cube which kids would gobble down. Now they have to hold them down while they stick a needle in them. And if they run short of needles they just reuse the old ones and who knows what disease they may be spreading but AIDS has increased in the areas.......~gd

 

[lorihadams]

I love my friend and she is a teacher so the "got to get your vaccinations or the world will end" thing has been pumped into her so much that it stuck.

Anyway, it just got me thinking about whether the vaccinations that my children have already received are enough for now until they are older and need hepatitis and such. My state requires that all girls age 9 or older be vaccinated with the HPV vaccine as well. Not quite sure on that one either.

 

[MountainMom]

Just a piece of advice:
Not vaccinating is not something you want to advertise. Unfortunately, people are not tolerant of those who deviate from society's accepted norm in this regard. Pretend you are an anti-Communist in the Soviet Union regarding your non-compliance with the CCD guidelines on vaccination.

 

[Wildsky]

We pretty much wiped out 2 nasty diseases(in the USA) and greatly reduced the incidence of several others.

Just curious, which 2 are those? and which were "greatly reduced"?




I'd dump the friend if it wasn't too much of an issue for me, if she's a better friend than that I would consider just lying about it. (how's she gonna know?)
If you think she might find out, perhaps just ask outright which ones she's concerned with, then you can go deeper into the issue regarding the severity of the disease in question, and ask her if she'll please sign a form taking all responsibilies (financial included) should your children suffer any of the side effects, and list them! (might just pop her eyes RIGHT open!)

I would never go get my kids vaccinated because I couldn't go on a play date, I'd just find better friends.

 

[Quail_Antwerp]

Lori, if you want to know if your kids are still protected by the vaccines they've already had, you can request a titer. It's a blood test, but it shows WHAT antibodies they still have.

My first three kids have had all of their shots, but the younger two have not. In fact, baby boy has had none.

I am not anti-vaccinate, but I'm not necessarily pro either. It's a personal choice.

Some would say I used my kids as "guinea pigs", but from my own five children, this is what I've experienced. My DD would run a fever for several days and be extremely cranky after her vaccinations. Not only that, but they start hammering them in at 2 months of age, and I was a breast feeding mom! DD was sick A LOT the first year and hospitalized multiple times for high fevers.

Baby 2 - our first DS - I waited until he was 15 months old before getting any shots - got a huge lecture from Doctor about it. DS1 had never been sick that first year - but as soon as we started the shots, fevers, crankiness, and sick A LOT.

Same with baby's 3 and 4.

Baby 5 - is two years old, never had to be hospitalized for high fevers, hasn't had the flu (yet), hasn't had multiple fevers (did run a slight low grade fever when he was teething). He did around 1 year of age have a raging ear infection, which we took him to the ER because he had a high fever - but ear infections, last time I checked, are not covered in vaccinations. He has been our HEALTHIEST child, and the only one NOT vaccinated.

Again, though, I was a breastfeeding mom, and babies do get a lot of antibodies through mom, too.

And, my kids eat healthy for the most part (can't keep veggies or fruits in the house, and they love bacon!) and they play outside A LOT. Tons of fresh air, occasional blade of grass shoved up the nose with a cheerio (don't ask), and lots of mud and dirt = healthy kiddos! With natural immunities!!

 

[savingdogs]

I am a person who vaccinated all of my children and all of my dogs and cats for all things recommended by my doctors.

However, this friend sounds very controlling. Since the other children have had their vaccines, yours not being updated is really a silly thing to worry about, unless perhaps there was a specific outbreak in your area such as measles or such, which I assume by your post is not the case.

I would just let her know that you abide by her decision and then not go there with my kids again. I would not make a scene or an issue, I'd just have less time on my schedule for this particular person who seeks to control your decisions in that way. To be fair, she might have some sort of misplaced concerns that are meant to be helpful, but overall I find people who are overly controlling to be manipulative in other ways as well and it is better to be tipped of by this issue and not let this person have to much say or control in other aspects of my life.

 

[Beekissed]

I am a person who vaccinated all of my children and all of my dogs and cats for all things recommended by my doctors.

However, this friend sounds very controlling. Since the other children have had their vaccines, yours not being updated is really a silly thing to worry about, unless perhaps there was a specific outbreak in your area such as measles or such, which I assume by your post is not the case.

I would just let her know that you abide by her decision and then not go there with my kids again. I would not make a scene or an issue, I'd just have less time on my schedule for this particular person who seeks to control your decisions in that way. To be fair, she might have some sort of misplaced concerns that are meant to be helpful, but overall I find people who are overly controlling to be manipulative in other ways as well and it is better to be tipped of by this issue and not let this person have to much say or control in other aspects of my life.

I agree with this very much. This person seems to be inflicting her ideals on you and punishing your children by not allowing them to play with hers until you comply with her way of thinking. NOT a friend at all, IMO.

And I also agree with what Aly had to say....a simple blood test can determine if your children have the proper antibodies in their systems.

My sons just did this~titer levels~ upon entry into the military and it was interesting to discover that my boys had to take only 3 shots compared to the other men's 11 to 12 injections to boost their original vaccines. My son's sargeant even commented on it and was amazed that Eli had converted so completely.

I'm just glad they didn't have to have all that put into their systems once again. I wish I had been more informed when they were babies for I believe I would have refused most of the vaccines they said were "mandatory".

 

[~gd]

I am a person who vaccinated all of my children and all of my dogs and cats for all things recommended by my doctors.

However, this friend sounds very controlling. Since the other children have had their vaccines, yours not being updated is really a silly thing to worry about, unless perhaps there was a specific outbreak in your area such as measles or such, which I assume by your post is not the case.

I would just let her know that you abide by her decision and then not go there with my kids again. I would not make a scene or an issue, I'd just have less time on my schedule for this particular person who seeks to control your decisions in that way. To be fair, she might have some sort of misplaced concerns that are meant to be helpful, but overall I find people who are overly controlling to be manipulative in other ways as well and it is better to be tipped of by this issue and not let this person have to much say or control in other aspects of my life.

I agree with this very much. This person seems to be inflicting her ideals on you and punishing your children by not allowing them to play with hers until you comply with her way of thinking. NOT a friend at all, IMO.

And I also agree with what Aly had to say....a simple blood test can determine if your children have the proper antibodies in their systems. Must be they finally have the robots doing these titers because they were far from simple to do manually! 8 dilutions for each antibody tested for to cover the wide range of possible antibody and then every dilution had to be read and the results entered into a spread sheet to do the calculations. each tech was expected to do 12 individuals/shift, fall below that level and you were asked to go elsewhere ie fired. a top producer (always young females because of the fine hand/eye coordination required) might average 15 per day. Burn out lifetime was usually about 2 years since you were doing the same thing over and over again every day. The job just screamed for a robot to do it.

My sons just did this~titer levels~ upon entry into the military and it was interesting to discover that my boys had to take only 3 shots compared to the other men's 11 to 12 injections to boost their original vaccines. My son's sargeant even commented on it and was amazed that Eli had converted so completely.

I'm just glad they didn't have to have all that put into their systems once again. I wish I had been more informed when they were babies for I believe I would have refused most of the vaccines they said were "mandatory".

 

[~gd]

Lori, if you want to know if your kids are still protected by the vaccines they've already had, you can request a titer. It's a blood test, but it shows WHAT antibodies they still have.

My first three kids have had all of their shots, but the younger two have not. In fact, baby boy has had none.

I am not anti-vaccinate, but I'm not necessarily pro either. It's a personal choice.

Some would say I used my kids as "guinea pigs", but from my own five children, this is what I've experienced. My DD would run a fever for several days and be extremely cranky after her vaccinations. Not only that, but they start hammering them in at 2 months of age, and I was a breast feeding mom! DD was sick A LOT the first year and hospitalized multiple times for high fevers.

Baby 2 - our first DS - I waited until he was 15 months old before getting any shots - got a huge lecture from Doctor about it. DS1 had never been sick that first year - but as soon as we started the shots, fevers, crankiness, and sick A LOT.

Same with baby's 3 and 4.

Baby 5 - is two years old, never had to be hospitalized for high fevers, hasn't had the flu (yet), hasn't had multiple fevers (did run a slight low grade fever when he was teething). He did around 1 year of age have a raging ear infection, which we took him to the ER because he had a high fever - but ear infections, last time I checked, are not covered in vaccinations.Actually when we did clinical trials for approval for the pneumococcal vaccine the total number of ear infections in vaccinated group were HALF that in the control group! the effect was so noteable that many of the docs guessed the test group from the control group. We reported this to the FDA because we were afraid they would declare the double blind study to be invalid! They told us that it was expected by them since they had studied the causes of ear infections. We were NOT allowed to make an ad claim because 50% was not considered to be a valid vaccine. Word spred amoung the Peds though because many of them were sick of treating some kids 5 or 6 times a year for the same old ear infections! ~gd He has been our HEALTHIEST child, and the only one NOT vaccinated.

Again, though, I was a breastfeeding mom, and babies do get a lot of antibodies through mom, too.Also the leading cause of HepB in infants, usually they test the mom and if she is a carrier the infant gets a vaccination at BIRTH with a booster in the 6-18 months window.~gd

And, my kids eat healthy for the most part (can't keep veggies or fruits in the house, and they love bacon!) and they play outside A LOT. Tons of fresh air, occasional blade of grass shoved up the nose with a cheerio (don't ask), and lots of mud and dirt = healthy kiddos! With natural immunities!!

The way to get natural immunities is to get exposed to the disease and beat it off. A healthy immunune system is the result of a healthy lifestyle, the body is ready to start producing antibodies at the first sign of a pathogen.~gd