freemotion
Food Guru
I am a smart person. Years ago, I tried to follow the food pyramid. I ate corn and peas as my veggies! Duh!
I watched the documentary "Fat Head" ....
- Thread starter okiegirl1
- Start date
Beekissed
Mountain Sage
Kudos to you gals! I would go crazy trying to keep track of how many of this or that I eat every day. I stick to normal food and don't give it much thought, but I'm sure I would be more into all that if I had health problems.
Lots of info to digest out there, isn't there?
Lots of info to digest out there, isn't there?
Dace
Revolution in Progress
I didn't say that they were trying to kill us but I do think that the almighty dollar is leading the charge, not what is really in our best interest. Did you read my poem several pages back?me&thegals said:Well, I agree that not all the gov't says is trueDace said:The trifecta...big agro, government & pharm. They are trying so hard to keep us fed that they are killing us.
Just sayin'.
Post #62
bibliophile birds
Lovin' The Homestead
i'm coming to this party late, but i wanted to add some things and expand on what a few others have already said.
the danger with comparing prehistoric forager diets and agriculturist diets and drawing broad conclusions is that the facts become quite oversimplified. as someone else said, studying Egyptian mummies (from any class) and those of European foragers is almost useless. there are too many factors outside of simple high-meat/high-carb dietary discrepancies. you have to factor in the types of meat that were eaten, the types of carbs that were eaten, the comparison of actual carb load in wild vs domesticated plants, calories expended to acquire those food sources, average lifespan, weather patterns affecting growing seasons, etc etc.
prehistoric foragers didn't eat all that much meat either. there were whole parts of the year where hunting was almost impossible or the animals just didn't appear. they relied a lot on dried meats and cached plants, many of which were starchy tubers. how does wild meat nutritionally compare with early agriculturist meats?
what prehistoric people actually ate varied widely, as does what modern portions of those populations eat today. where do the Masai, who subsist on large amounts of cows blood but rarely eat meat, fall on this scale? i think carb tolerance is akin to lactose tolerance in that certain groups have lost the gene that allows them to process it and others haven't.
there were lots of studies done in the early 90s about diabetes and ethnicity. they were finding that Mexican-Americans (particularly immigrants) had the highest rate of diabetes. this was attributed to the high level of corn in their diet. later studies, however, countered that it wasn't the level of corn in their diet that was the problem. it was their socioeconomic status. Mexican-Americans living below the poverty line were 80% more likely to have diabetes than Mexican-Americans living above the poverty line or Mexicans living in Mexico. they all ate about the same amount of corn.
on a personal note, my mother has had high cholesterol and high blood pressure for as long as i can remember (like me, she also has hypothyroid). she was on all kinds of medications that just didn't seem to be helping at all, and she was eating low-carb. one night she thought she was having a heart attack and passed out. turns out, her cholesterol medication (Lipitor at the time, i believe) was blocking the absorption of potassium and it almost killed her. the combination of drugs she was taking was like a time-bomb. since that day almost 3 years ago, she's not taken ANY cholesterol or blood pressure medication and she's eating carbs again, in moderation. instead she drinks a glass of red wine every night. both her cholesterol and blood pressure have come down significantly and she's had no more problems with potassium.
obviously, there are people who just can't eat carbs. i understand that. i can't eat soy because of my thyroid. but i don't think a blanket boycott of carbs is the solution for most people. i think healthy, natural carbs are important. instead of cutting a food group from your menu, we should all spend more time thinking about where our food comes from and why we eat it.
the danger with comparing prehistoric forager diets and agriculturist diets and drawing broad conclusions is that the facts become quite oversimplified. as someone else said, studying Egyptian mummies (from any class) and those of European foragers is almost useless. there are too many factors outside of simple high-meat/high-carb dietary discrepancies. you have to factor in the types of meat that were eaten, the types of carbs that were eaten, the comparison of actual carb load in wild vs domesticated plants, calories expended to acquire those food sources, average lifespan, weather patterns affecting growing seasons, etc etc.
prehistoric foragers didn't eat all that much meat either. there were whole parts of the year where hunting was almost impossible or the animals just didn't appear. they relied a lot on dried meats and cached plants, many of which were starchy tubers. how does wild meat nutritionally compare with early agriculturist meats?
what prehistoric people actually ate varied widely, as does what modern portions of those populations eat today. where do the Masai, who subsist on large amounts of cows blood but rarely eat meat, fall on this scale? i think carb tolerance is akin to lactose tolerance in that certain groups have lost the gene that allows them to process it and others haven't.
there were lots of studies done in the early 90s about diabetes and ethnicity. they were finding that Mexican-Americans (particularly immigrants) had the highest rate of diabetes. this was attributed to the high level of corn in their diet. later studies, however, countered that it wasn't the level of corn in their diet that was the problem. it was their socioeconomic status. Mexican-Americans living below the poverty line were 80% more likely to have diabetes than Mexican-Americans living above the poverty line or Mexicans living in Mexico. they all ate about the same amount of corn.
on a personal note, my mother has had high cholesterol and high blood pressure for as long as i can remember (like me, she also has hypothyroid). she was on all kinds of medications that just didn't seem to be helping at all, and she was eating low-carb. one night she thought she was having a heart attack and passed out. turns out, her cholesterol medication (Lipitor at the time, i believe) was blocking the absorption of potassium and it almost killed her. the combination of drugs she was taking was like a time-bomb. since that day almost 3 years ago, she's not taken ANY cholesterol or blood pressure medication and she's eating carbs again, in moderation. instead she drinks a glass of red wine every night. both her cholesterol and blood pressure have come down significantly and she's had no more problems with potassium.
obviously, there are people who just can't eat carbs. i understand that. i can't eat soy because of my thyroid. but i don't think a blanket boycott of carbs is the solution for most people. i think healthy, natural carbs are important. instead of cutting a food group from your menu, we should all spend more time thinking about where our food comes from and why we eat it.
Wifezilla
Low-Carb Queen - RIP: 1963-2021
Like the carbs in kale. NOT the carbs in industrial processed bread, whole grain or otherwise.
Nutritionally, there is NO SUCH THING as an essential carbohydrate. Seriously. No protein and you die. No fat and you die. No carbohydrates? No problem.
I guess I should add the word UNNECESSARY in front of the word carbs in my statements. Of course, since I think any more than 50g of carbs per day is unnecessary, it doesn't leave a lot of room for bread
Healthy carbs....
Carbs in greens and other veggies. Carbs in berries and other low sugar fruits. Carbs in natural whole dairy. Carbs in squash.
Unhealthy carbs...
Carbs from industrial corn, wheat, soy, potatoes, rice, etc.. Carbs from sugar. Carbs from high fructose corn syrup, dextrose, or the hundereds of other products that end in "ose" and are derived from corn, carbs from anything that comes out of a box...especially the boxes with a cartoon character on the front.
Carbs people think are healthy but aren't....
Whole grain bread (unless you soaked and fermented the grains yourself), whole grain breakfast cereal, granola, protein bars or health bars (particularly those made of soy), instant oat meal, brown rice, skim or low fat milk, yogurt or anything else for that matter with low, reduced or fat-free on the label, basically anything outlined in a health magazine, fruits and vegetables engineered to have higher sugar content, agave nectar (about as "natural" as high fructose corn syrup), pita bread, whole wheat tortillas, etc...
Dace
Revolution in Progress
i think healthy, natural carbs are important. instead of cutting a food group from your menu, we should all spend more time thinking about where our food comes from and why we eat it.
That is what most of us involved in this post are saying....cut out refined carbs and sugar, learn how to prepare your grains so that the nutrients are more readily available for your body. No one here has cut out the complete food group, not sure that is even possible.
That is what most of us involved in this post are saying....cut out refined carbs and sugar, learn how to prepare your grains so that the nutrients are more readily available for your body. No one here has cut out the complete food group, not sure that is even possible.
Dace
Revolution in Progress
So to summarize....if you can't grow it or make it from scratch yourself you probably should not eat itWifezilla said:Like the carbs in kale. NOT the carbs in industrial processed bread, whole grain or otherwise.
Nutritionally, there is NO SUCH THING as an essential carbohydrate. Seriously. No protein and you die. No fat and you die. No carbohydrates? No problem.
I guess I should add the word UNNECESSARY in front of the word carbs in my statements. Of course, since I think any more than 50g of carbs per day is unnecessary, it doesn't leave a lot of room for bread
Healthy carbs....
Carbs in greens and other veggies. Carbs in berries and other low sugar fruits. Carbs in natural whole dairy. Carbs in squash.
Unhealthy carbs...
Carbs from industrial corn, wheat, soy, potatoes, rice, etc.. Carbs from sugar. Carbs from high fructose corn syrup, dextrose, or the hundereds of other products that end in "ose" and are derived from corn, carbs from anything that comes out of a box...especially the boxes with a cartoon character on the front.
Carbs people think are healthy but aren't....
Whole grain bread (unless you soaked and fermented the grains yourself), whole grain breakfast cereal, granola, protein bars or health bars (particularly those made of soy), instant oat meal, brown rice, skim or low fat milk, yogurt or anything else for that matter with low, reduced or fat-free on the label, basically anything outlined in a health magazine, fruits and vegetables engineered to have higher sugar content, agave nectar (about as "natural" as high fructose corn syrup), pita bread, whole wheat tortillas, etc...
Really, just exaggerating.
freemotion
Food Guru
In my travels, I've found that most vegetarians are carbo-tarians in reality. Actually, every single one that has shared their diet with me eats mostly carbs and soy.
One young woman, dear to me, cannot conceive. She doesn't want to know about soy. So I don't tell her after the initial conversation. I did get through to her hubby, though, and he is reading Sally Fallon and Mary Enig and Weston Price now. She also has B vitamin deficiencies. As per her doctor. Although she eats a lot of colorful veggies and LOOKS healthy, she is not. She has shared her health concerns with me, although she is not ready for my input and may never be. She eats mostly carbs as grains and soy. Makes me sad.
I know this was your experience, too, WZ.
My best friend gets fatter and fatter by the month, and it is getting frightening to me. She maintained a healthy weight for many years and suddenly, without diet changes, boom! Fat! She eats mostly carbs, and mostly "good" carbs. Along with lots of fresh fruits and coloful veggies....and soy. Low fat. I love her like a sister but she thinks my diet stuff is weird.
My new method is to cook lovely gourmet meals (what we eat every day) and invite these people to join me. I can do a wonderful ovo-lacto vegetarian meal with no trouble. They always rave over it. Always. Sometimes it opens the door a tiny crack.
One young woman, dear to me, cannot conceive. She doesn't want to know about soy. So I don't tell her after the initial conversation. I did get through to her hubby, though, and he is reading Sally Fallon and Mary Enig and Weston Price now. She also has B vitamin deficiencies. As per her doctor. Although she eats a lot of colorful veggies and LOOKS healthy, she is not. She has shared her health concerns with me, although she is not ready for my input and may never be. She eats mostly carbs as grains and soy. Makes me sad.
I know this was your experience, too, WZ.
My best friend gets fatter and fatter by the month, and it is getting frightening to me. She maintained a healthy weight for many years and suddenly, without diet changes, boom! Fat! She eats mostly carbs, and mostly "good" carbs. Along with lots of fresh fruits and coloful veggies....and soy. Low fat. I love her like a sister but she thinks my diet stuff is weird.
My new method is to cook lovely gourmet meals (what we eat every day) and invite these people to join me. I can do a wonderful ovo-lacto vegetarian meal with no trouble. They always rave over it. Always. Sometimes it opens the door a tiny crack.
Beekissed
Mountain Sage
Free, my mom and pop are vegans and they eat mostly raw veggies and fruits...very little carbs but not exactly by intent, it's just how their diet is.
I think you are right.... a lot of vegatarians try to fill the gap left by meat and dairy by substituting with soy and grains. My folks don't fill any gaps, they don't feel their diet has any. They eat plenty of legumes and use olive oil a lot, bread rarely but it's whole wheat when they do. No refined sugars, raw honey only. My 75 yr. mother has the bone mass of a 21 year old, if anyone is thinking they are missing out on essential calcium by eliminating dairy.
I think every diet benefits most by the old adage: " Everything in moderation. " I really don't trust any diet info that excludes all fats, all carbs, all sugars, or all of any one thing.
I like to mix a little of my folks' wisdom and diet with a little of my own and find that this suits me. I keep it simple, keep it healthy and homegrown, drink plenty of water and eat plenty of raw veggies and fruit .
I think you are right.... a lot of vegatarians try to fill the gap left by meat and dairy by substituting with soy and grains. My folks don't fill any gaps, they don't feel their diet has any. They eat plenty of legumes and use olive oil a lot, bread rarely but it's whole wheat when they do. No refined sugars, raw honey only. My 75 yr. mother has the bone mass of a 21 year old, if anyone is thinking they are missing out on essential calcium by eliminating dairy.
I think every diet benefits most by the old adage: " Everything in moderation. " I really don't trust any diet info that excludes all fats, all carbs, all sugars, or all of any one thing.
I like to mix a little of my folks' wisdom and diet with a little of my own and find that this suits me. I keep it simple, keep it healthy and homegrown, drink plenty of water and eat plenty of raw veggies and fruit .
