rty007 winemaking Q

[rty007]

@ QA - pig matter
durocs are a lot darker in color from those I want, and as you said they do not have a droopy ear.

@ FF - lamb matter
I am looking into it as well, buying on hoof, BUT I will so fly out of home to a life of a single probably renting a lodging, which I rented some time ago where the freezer space is limited to one basket , which is quite bad if you ask me.

@ FF - chicken "recultivation"...
I am not really an egg person, I am a chicken meat person. So i am more interested in flushing the junk out of its tiny body. and roasting it on firee ...muahaha .. yh.. uh.... cough cough ... huh

@ FF - roos
Ok how is it with the roos fighting, do they fight one another before they reach "maturity" it is called somehow.. before they start to clutch? And one the permaculture guys said that he keeps a pure roo pen without hens, and that they do not fight then at least before the age <- mentioned before, which I find hard to believe, BUT since someone not pointing fingers ,said that they call her "the chicken lady" maybe she could tell me if that might be true? If that is true (which I doubt) it would be great just to fatten em up and then.. wham whack the back of the head and into the freezer(after processing that is).

@ FF - about bunnies
If I would find a bunnie at that price, I wouldn't hesitate one moment. but around here, they charge like 3$/kg= 1,3$/lb that averages about 12-20$ per head which is not something I am willing to pay for an animal I am not sure of the feeding system and age. And I am thinking that colony keeping would make it a tad easier.

@ FF - calf
That is a thing to consider.

 

[Farmfresh]

Back in the day, when I was a kid, we raised and showed bantams. We used to keep a stag pen, which was roosters ONLY. It seems they (well most of them anyway) have very little problems getting along as long as there are NO women involved. Kinda like people I guess. These were ADULT male birds of various kinds. The exception to that rule was birds of fighting ancestry, the game cocks. They can't get along with anybody it seems!

As far as young stock is concerned they all get along pretty well until they reach sexual maturity. When they get older they spend all of their time (and food calories) chasing each other around, instead of getting fat for my pot!

When you are raising a hybrid meat bird this is a non problem because they get big enough to put in the freezer WAY before they are sexually mature. Some of mine are still peeping when they talk at 5 pounds!! If you are raising the heritage type of bird I would just plan on separating the males from the females when they start to mature. Makes it easier on everybody.

Speaking of which, I hear that a Buff Orpington X Dorking cross is supposed to be one of the tastiest birds you can breed.

The main problem with eating the commercial layers would probably be body size. Most commercial birds are quite small with white egg types around 4-5 pounds and brown egg types around 5-6 pounds. Commercial egg producers want as small a bird as possible while still laying a decent sized egg. It costs less to feed a small bird.

I guess I am kind of a "chicken lady". I have been keeping chickens for over 35 years!! I have raised and shown bantams, been a youth 4-H club poultry leader and even acted as a poultry judge on occasion.

 

[Farmfresh]

By colony keeping - with the rabbits - what are you referring too?

Are you talking about the large pen system with does and buck living together?

 

[rty007]

@ FF - colony
yes, exactly. I know a breeder who rises rabbits on 0.25 acre paddocks, I can't remember the numbers but they ain't very high, I mean the density.

Polish red cattle:

Polish red cattle breed comes from a line of small shorthorn cattle, living in west parts of middle Europe and Scandinavian. Spreading red colored cows across Poland can be associated with migration of people that took place in XVI century. In 1894 a first association of red cattle breeders was founded, on the "małopolskie (like a "state/part" of poland) towarzystwo (association) rolnicze(agricultural)"(malopolskie agricultural association) In 1901 L. Adametz first described polish red breed, in 1906 cows milk productivity assessment was first introduced into the offices, in 1913 it became officially a certified breed. Between 1906-1913 productivity of those cows, averaged between 1888-3349kg.

In the time between WW I and WW II polish red cow made up to 25% of cattle in Poland. Three "branches" of that breed were widely recognized: mountain, flatland's and slaska (part of Poland). After WW II, even in the late 60's red cow head count was at about 2 mln which was about 18% of all cattle. from 1959 it was crossed in different parts of the country with dutch red and jersey. In 1969 the administration ( you have to remember that a lot of the agricultural production was in the hands of the government for a very long time in poland) decided to stop research and work on red cattle in order to introduce black-white red-white.

then they say all the shebang about how the agricultural code and regionalism of agricultural codes changed, how thehead count went down... and jada jada.

justification the need of protecion.
Polish red cattle is one of the very few autochthonic European red cow breeds. It has all the features of a autochthonic breed: high resistance, good health, longevity, fertility, easy birth, easy calf upbringing, and high biological value of milk. Very important is a magnificent ability to withstand harsh Polish atmospheric conditions, the fact that they are not very picky about their diet, the ability to stop productivity in order to push through times of scarce feed, as well as fast regeneration. Its well built legs, hard foot make it a great breed for mountain living and production. It is also has a few incredible milk features: high protein, fat and dry matter, high biological value and high value in cheese making ( the last one sold it to me)

I am sorry for the raw translation, I will smooth it out tomorrow.

 

[freemotion]

Those cows are beautiful!!!!

 

[Farmfresh]

Agreed very beautiful cattle!

I heard of a rabbit colony plan that involved a relatively small space. You start with about a 2 or 3 dozen bales of good alfalfa or clover hay and three unrelated does plus an unrelated buck of whatever breed you choose.

First the colony is constructed by digging out a space that is the depth of one hay bale standing on its side (like the grass grew). At the bottom of the space you lay down a section of sturdy wire with a mesh strong and small enough to contain a rabbit. Then you attach more of the wire to the bottom but standing upright all around the edges of the space.

Fill the dug out space with hay bales packed tightly together to fill up the entire space. Cut the twine and remove it from the bales as you go. Next add a second layer to the enclosure. Some even add a third layer of hay. When you end there should be basically a wire box with two or three layers of hay bales and about two or three feet of free space above the whole hay mass. Finally a top is put on the cage and then a roof is placed over the whole setup to provide weather protection and shade.

To this environment you add the rabbits. All you do at this point is provide fresh water, mineral and salt licks, and grain which is fed on the bale surface. The rabbits eat the hay and create burrows down inside the hay and all through it. Periodically you can harvest rabbits for meat. The colony will multiply in breeding as it grows.

After a while, when the hay supply begins to show signs of severe deterioration, all of the rabbits are harvested. The remnants of hay are removed to be used as mulch in the garden.

Then you can start again with fresh hay and a new unrelated base stock of rabbits.

I have never done this, but I understand you can grow a huge supply of meat this way.

 

[rty007]

@ FF - colony
lik
That is what I am talking about, however it depends on what you mean a small space? The breeder I talked to apart from the padocs now has something very similar to what you describe, except: he has his wire dug down to about 3,5feet (1m) dirt on that, then one bale to the ground level, and one above. he has his roof at his head high from the ground 5 feet(he is not very tall). his pens are something like... 2,4m(8feet) wide and about 6m(20feet) long he says he starts with 4 does and a buck. Maintenance is quite the same. During very harsh winters he takes them inside, but he says that once he had a couple of rabbits survive in the burrows(after he took the rest indoors), and they were in a better shape then their friends.

rabbits: Krlik popielański biały (Popielański white)

Popielańskie white rabbits is the last polish breed left. Works on establishing this breed began in 1950 on the experimental institute of zootechnics in Chorzelowo (city in poland) and they were conducted by prof. Z. Kamiński. Later the study took place in the academy of science in Popielno(name of city) which they took name after. Later on, mr. W. Karłowicz took over the reaserch. This breed has white fur, litters of 7-8 kits and a average of raising up 6,5 kit. Their body weight grows fast, reaching even 6,5lb at the age of 90days, with a high butchering efficiency (I am not sure what they mean) at 60%.The breed is featured by high capability to adapt to polish harsh enviroment, which is especially important in free-range keeping

 

[Quail_Antwerp]

Agreed very beautiful cattle!

I heard of a rabbit colony plan that involved a relatively small space. You start with about a 2 or 3 dozen bales of good alfalfa or clover hay and three unrelated does plus an unrelated buck of whatever breed you choose.

First the colony is constructed by digging out a space that is the depth of one hay bale standing on its side (like the grass grew). At the bottom of the space you lay down a section of sturdy wire with a mesh strong and small enough to contain a rabbit. Then you attach more of the wire to the bottom but standing upright all around the edges of the space.

Fill the dug out space with hay bales packed tightly together to fill up the entire space. Cut the twine and remove it from the bales as you go. Next add a second layer to the enclosure. Some even add a third layer of hay. When you end there should be basically a wire box with two or three layers of hay bales and about two or three feet of free space above the whole hay mass. Finally a top is put on the cage and then a roof is placed over the whole setup to provide weather protection and shade.

To this environment you add the rabbits. All you do at this point is provide fresh water, mineral and salt licks, and grain which is fed on the bale surface. The rabbits eat the hay and create burrows down inside the hay and all through it. Periodically you can harvest rabbits for meat. The colony will multiply in breeding as it grows.

After a while, when the hay supply begins to show signs of severe deterioration, all of the rabbits are harvested. The remnants of hay are removed to be used as mulch in the garden.

Then you can start again with fresh hay and a new unrelated base stock of rabbits.

I have never done this, but I understand you can grow a huge supply of meat this way.

That is really interesting! I may very well have to try that, as it will save me on having individual rabbit hutches all year round!

Hmm.... copying and pasting and saving....

 

[rty007]

I have a question tho, the breeder says he basically leaves preggers in there to deal with it on their own, so I went:
"haay but that is kind of mean... what if some of the other ones will get into the burrow and do something to the kits?" I said that with a little bit of a smile.
"well, my friend... its nature at its finest work, called life."
But yeah, I think he has a good idea about that, just provide enough water, feed and get the hell out of its way. I mean if they can dig burrows, they should be just fine.

 

[rty007]

Q - orchard

OK, here it comes. some of you talk about sweeping the leaves out of the orchard? is that because of the bugs and parasites in there that you don't want to multiply? I mean it is a good idea to allow a couple of chickens to scratch through it, to shred the leaves a bit and eat the bugs. I mean they should make a good mulch, right? Or am getting something wrong?